UPT phases
03-01-2009, 08:56 PM
#1
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UPT phases
This thread is started to share information of the different phases of training during USAF UPT.
Floridagator said:
So let me get this right.....this is just the T-6A phases of training correct - so the equivalent of USN/USMC/USCG Primary T-34C training.
I am really surprised by how many FAIPs you say there are in the flights.
We don't have SERGRADs teaching T-34 students do we (Bunk, FlyBoyd?)
USMCFLYR
Floridagator said:
I cant remember...because these posts have like ten different conversations going on...but I think you asked about UPT.
As for Vance...in beautiful Enid OK. (feel the sarcasm....and yes, detroying OK in the national championship was bliss) it was broken up into 3 squadrons. t-27 squadron, t-38 squadron, & T1 squadron. The squadrons were run by a Lt Col. and broken down into flights. Each T-37 and T-1 flight was headed by a Captian who had about 8 instructors working under him. 7 were First Assignment Instructor Pilots (FAIPS) 1st LT's, and usually there was one or two captains for whatever reason. T-38's had very few FAIPS and instuctors and flight commanders were always Majors or Lt. Col's due to the intensity of the program.
Programs were broken down into 3 or 4 phases.
1st Phase Contact. Typical Loops, Cuban 8's Chandelles, Split-S, Spins and every other aerobatic imaginable. MUCH more cool than Commercial training in a complex General Aviation aircraft.
2nd Phase - Instrument. Not much to talk about here. Mostly book work, but all-in-all, I liked the 141 training better.
3rd Phase - Formation. This is unlike anything I every experienced in my Civilian training. Very demanding. Completely unapplicable to what I do under 121.
4th Phase - Low Level. Usually only 2 or 3 sorties. No different than buzzing along at 500' in GA with a VFR sectional. Not a memorable phase.
As for Vance...in beautiful Enid OK. (feel the sarcasm....and yes, detroying OK in the national championship was bliss) it was broken up into 3 squadrons. t-27 squadron, t-38 squadron, & T1 squadron. The squadrons were run by a Lt Col. and broken down into flights. Each T-37 and T-1 flight was headed by a Captian who had about 8 instructors working under him. 7 were First Assignment Instructor Pilots (FAIPS) 1st LT's, and usually there was one or two captains for whatever reason. T-38's had very few FAIPS and instuctors and flight commanders were always Majors or Lt. Col's due to the intensity of the program.
Programs were broken down into 3 or 4 phases.
1st Phase Contact. Typical Loops, Cuban 8's Chandelles, Split-S, Spins and every other aerobatic imaginable. MUCH more cool than Commercial training in a complex General Aviation aircraft.
2nd Phase - Instrument. Not much to talk about here. Mostly book work, but all-in-all, I liked the 141 training better.
3rd Phase - Formation. This is unlike anything I every experienced in my Civilian training. Very demanding. Completely unapplicable to what I do under 121.
4th Phase - Low Level. Usually only 2 or 3 sorties. No different than buzzing along at 500' in GA with a VFR sectional. Not a memorable phase.
I am really surprised by how many FAIPs you say there are in the flights.
We don't have SERGRADs teaching T-34 students do we (Bunk, FlyBoyd?)
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Slice
Referring to your question in another post, there are 3 phases in UPT.
Phase 1 is academics, 2 is T-37's(now T-6), 3 is T-38 or T-1 track. Your 'phases' above are a break down of Phase 2 and 3.
Phase 1 is academics, 2 is T-37's(now T-6), 3 is T-38 or T-1 track. Your 'phases' above are a break down of Phase 2 and 3.
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by USMCFLYR
So coming out of UPT - you have done academics, instrument, formation and a few low levels? How many hours will you have when finally winged?
USMCFLYR
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by TankerBob
I think that guys are getting right around 250-270hrs now. There are a few more flights in the T-6 then were in the T-37 syllabus.
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by TankerBob
I think that guys are getting right around 250-270hrs now. There are a few more flights in the T-6 then were in the T-37 syllabus.
Where does the T-1 differ then than the T-38 track? It is after T-6s right?
Are you saying that the T-1 guys are getting winged with 250-270 hours?
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by USMCFLYR
TankerBob -
Where does the T-1 differ then than the T-38 track? It is after T-6s right?
Are you saying that the T-1 guys are getting winged with 250-270 hours?
USMCFLYR
Where does the T-1 differ then than the T-38 track? It is after T-6s right?
Are you saying that the T-1 guys are getting winged with 250-270 hours?
USMCFLYR
The T1 track is preparing you to fly something heavy. It is very intensive on instrument flying and mission planning along with a fair share of low levels, simulated airdrops, and simulated AR's where the 38 is preparing you to fly something with a strike mission so it has a lot of aerobatics, formation flying, and low levels with a little bit of instruments/navigation mixed in there.
But yes they both occur after the T6 phase and you earn your wings after completing the T1/T38 track.
03-02-2009, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by FLY6584
No way. I finished phase 2 with exactly 86 hours in the T6 then I think I'll have around that or maybe a little more in the T1 come thursday when I'll be UPT complete! I'd definitely say no more than 175 hours total for all of SUPT. I think the 38 guys may get a few more hours, but I doubt 250-270 though.
The T1 track is preparing you to fly something heavy. It is very intensive on instrument flying and mission planning along with a fair share of low levels, simulated airdrops, and simulated AR's where the 38 is preparing you to fly something with a strike mission so it has a lot of aerobatics, formation flying, and low levels with a little bit of instruments/navigation mixed in there.
But yes they both occur after the T6 phase and you earn your wings after completing the T1/T38 track.
The T1 track is preparing you to fly something heavy. It is very intensive on instrument flying and mission planning along with a fair share of low levels, simulated airdrops, and simulated AR's where the 38 is preparing you to fly something with a strike mission so it has a lot of aerobatics, formation flying, and low levels with a little bit of instruments/navigation mixed in there.
But yes they both occur after the T6 phase and you earn your wings after completing the T1/T38 track.
I came out of T-34s (Primary) with 60+ hrs.
Came out of Intermediate Strike with another 80 hrs in the T-2C.
Then got a little over 100+ hrs in the TA-4J to get winged.
Now remember - I had to go through basicaly the AM stage and instrument stage on each different aircraft too.
That was one part of the savings that was suppose to occur when they went to strictly the T-45 syllabus.
Advanced strike though was the only phase that we did strike, low levels, and BFM though we did do an air-to-air gunnery series of flights in the T-2C and we CQ'ed in both the jets too.
It is certainly interesting to see the differences in the training tracks.
USMCFLYR
03-02-2009, 05:30 PM
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USMCFLYR,
Combine what you know/knew to be primary and intermediates into just primary. Beef up your advanced a little and you have today's syllabus.
Our primary syllabus has 89 hrs so most studs end up with 90-100 as seen here https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/fol....140C_wch1.pdf.
Advanced tailhook (T-45) has 157.5 hours. https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/fol...5Awch1_ch2.pdf
Maritime (T-44/C-12) USN has 81.8, USAF has 102.9, USMC 98.9 from here https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/folder2/1542.147C.pdf.
So rolled up..
TACAIR Winged - 246.5
Maritime 170.8 to 191.9 dependent on service/platform
This is raw syllabus totals so add in about 10-15% for wx, warmups, etc. I left out E2/C2 and tiltrotor since they weren't in the discussion.
Hope this helps.
Combine what you know/knew to be primary and intermediates into just primary. Beef up your advanced a little and you have today's syllabus.
Our primary syllabus has 89 hrs so most studs end up with 90-100 as seen here https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/fol....140C_wch1.pdf.
Advanced tailhook (T-45) has 157.5 hours. https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/fol...5Awch1_ch2.pdf
Maritime (T-44/C-12) USN has 81.8, USAF has 102.9, USMC 98.9 from here https://www.cnatra.navy.mil/pubs/folder2/1542.147C.pdf.
So rolled up..
TACAIR Winged - 246.5
Maritime 170.8 to 191.9 dependent on service/platform
This is raw syllabus totals so add in about 10-15% for wx, warmups, etc. I left out E2/C2 and tiltrotor since they weren't in the discussion.
Hope this helps.
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