Hi,

I am currently a senior in high school. I have always wanted to fly for the airlines but recently at the Cleveland Air Show, seeing those fighter pilots lit a fire inside me. I now really want to fly fighter planes. Ok so here is my plan, Go to kent state next year and Major in business Management and Minor in Flight Tech. This will get me my ratings while getting a back up degree. During college I will do the Express Jet and Continental internships. During my senior year I will become A CFI and start to build hours and keep doing that till I have met the minimums for Express Jet. Then I will apply for express jet and hold a line for a year and then apply to The ANG fighter squadron in Ohio and hopefully get a fighter pilot slot. Then I will take military leave from express jet and fly some fighters while my senority is building up while on leave. Then I will return to Express Jet and become a Captain! Thoughts? Thank You!!

 

If you can pull it off, that is a good order in which to do it. There are no guarantees about getting the guard slot that you want (or any military flight slot) so you might want to consider multiple options. If you have a plan and work hard your odds are pretty good.

 

No, you should start applying the second you are eligible. Don't wait until you have been a lineholder at your regional. First of all, there is no guarantee that you'd get hired by the first (or fifth, or tenth) unit you interview with, let alone getting that interview in the first place so you want to start as young as possible. I don't know if you realize it yet, but those slots are extremely competitive, esp the fighters. Plus I think most fighter squadrons only interview once a year. And also, for Guard I think it may take up to two years between the time you interview and the time you actually go to UPT. So by the time you enter training, you might already be a captain! Which is still fine I think but it doesn't go along with your plan. I say get all the tests done and get your package together during college, and then start sending them out as soon as you get your degree.

 

What scares me about your dream is that the pinnacle is you becoming a Captain for a commuter airline.

 

It shouldn’t scare you. That is the most realistic career expectation. Instead of hoping to become a captain for a major, or even an FO, new pilots should plan on the possibility of being stuck at a commuter for life. It is not pretty, but at least you won’t be bitter when you are 45 and still in a CRJ when you realize that your dream to make captain at a major before you retire is out of the question. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyHigh423

Hi,

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyHigh423

I am currently a senior in high school. I have always wanted to fly for the airlines but recently at the Cleveland Air Show, seeing those fighter pilots lit a fire inside me. I now really want to fly fighter planes. Ok so here is my plan, Go to kent state next year and Major in business Management and Minor in Flight Tech. This will get me my ratings while getting a back up degree. During college I will do the Express Jet and Continental internships. During my senior year I will become A CFI and start to build hours and keep doing that till I have met the minimums for Express Jet. Then I will apply for express jet and hold a line for a year and then apply to The ANG fighter squadron in Ohio and hopefully get a fighter pilot slot. Then I will take military leave from express jet and fly some fighters while my senority is building up while on leave. Then I will return to Express Jet and become a Captain! Thoughts? Thank You!!

I thought for a while about whether to spend any time responding to this. I don’t want to completely discourage you but you need to examine your real motives and ensure your plan is realistic.
It’s good to have a plan – no doubt. It sounds like your ultimate goal is to be an airline pilot. Discussing that could take a whole thread and there are plenty of them on this forum so far. Please educate yourself on the reality of being an airline pilot, especially for a regional “express” carrier. I really don’t know why a person your age, with accurate knowledge of the airline industry would willingly choose that career path.

That said, if you really want to be an airline pilot, don’t go into the military. Becoming a fighter pilot in the Ohio guard or active duty is not something you do to kill time while your seniority improves at Express Jet.

If you want to be a fighter pilot, then don’t bother with the CFI job to build hours. Get your degree and get good grades. If you want to get some flying experience and you can get your private with the Flight Tech minor, that couldn’t hurt. Having a bunch of flight hours before going to UPT (Undergraduate Pilot Training) is not necessarily a helpful thing. Most of the fighter pilots I flew with in the USAF were zero time guys when they started training. Some had just gotten through solo in a Cessna. Many of those who washed out or didn’t excel during training were high time guys with lots of civilian experience. The bottom line is that a little pre-UPT experience will probably help but you will quickly reach a point where more is not better so don’t waste your time and money.

Becoming a fighter pilot is a huge commitment and will need to be your primary focus for many years following your entry into training. It’s a decision to become a warrior as well as a military officer serving your country. It’s highly likely that you will fly in combat if you’re lucky enough to be selected by a Guard unit to attend UPT. You will spend more than two years training to fly your fighter before you return to your unit. Once there, you will spend several months in your final mission ready check out. After that, you will probably spend anywhere from 18 months to 3 years as a wingman gaining experience. Realistically, you will probably need at least that first 12-18 months to get to a point where you are actually worth taking on a mission. As a new wingman, you will be a hindrance due to your lack of experience. You will want to minimize this time as a [new guy] and the only way to do that is constant self-study and maximum flying. This will benefit your Guard unit and more importantly you. The highly demanding environment of training missions as well as combat missions in fighters in as unforgiving as it gets. You do not want to min run your flight experience. So, taking some mil leave from Express Jet so you can “fly some fighters” is not a realistic plan.

I’m not saying that you should never consider a transition to the airline pilot career. Eventually you might decide that’s the route you want to take. However, going into fighter aviation with that as your one goal is a mistake. If you do decide to pursue that path, you should ensure you have a solid experience base in your fighter. Conservatively, I’d say you should plan on 4-6 years of full time flying after UPT (so 6-8 years from the time you start UPT).

I’ve got to assume that you don’t want to stay at Express Jet for your whole flying career – eventually you would leave there for a better job. So, you’d end up giving up all that seniority you are planning to build up on military leave anyway.
Realistically, you will probably spend that same 6-8 years slugging it out at ExpressJet before you’d be competitive to get hired at a major airline. So, you could spend 6-8 years after college flying an RJ around the US or flying in the military. Maybe you’ll decide the airlines aren’t your bag after all – at least if you’re in a fighter, you have a great aviation career to stick with rather than go the airline route and decide you don’t like it or worse get furloughed (possibly multiple times).

So, if you decide to try to fly for an airline, you can skip the regional airline/Express Jet part of your plan and go straight to a major airline. Every Guard unit is full of airline pilots who you will easily network with and who will be able to aid you in getting hired. One important point though: fighter pilots that take up part time positions as traditional Guardsmen as well as fly for an airline are usually highly experienced in their fighter. Only after years of fighter experience are they able to juggle both jobs effectively. Depending on their airline schedule, their Guard unit and their home life, it’s possible they may be away from their fighter cockpit for one or two weeks on a routine basis. That ability to jump back into fighter aviation and bring game after an absence like that is a challenge. The more experience you have the easier it is to make that transition and get back up on the step. Trying to go part time after just a few years will probably doom you to being a mediocre fighter pilot. That’s not a job you want to only be able to accomplish in a mediocre fashion.

This is just one guy’s opinion, so get more. I spent 22 years in the military, half active duty, half guard, so I didn’t take the same route you’re considering. I have flown in combat and I’ve spent plenty of time in Guard fighters while juggling an airline job. I hope my info will help you and good luck in your career, whatever you decide.

 

You're striving to be the "tip of the spear" so to speak for one type of flying, but then you want to be the skipper of the skies for some company that will hire just about anyone when needed with work rules so bad they actually can make Uncle Sam look bad???? It's almost as if you are comparing achieving becoming a fighter pilot with that of a commuter pilot. I mean, its so easy even a caveman can do it.

Seriously, if you're dream is to be a commuter pilot, this career field is long done and dead.

 

You are missing the point.

If you were recently at the Cleveland Air Show, your goal should be to hang out there in a flightsuit and score with lots of hot chicks.

Everything else just doesn't matter.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasserine06

It shouldn’t scare you. That is the most realistic career expectation. Instead of hoping to become a captain for a major, or even an FO, new pilots should plan on the possibility of being stuck at a commuter for life.

Perhaps FATboy was “scared” by the complete lack of judgment it shows to willingly embark on a career path with a final destination that’s the left seat of an RJ? I was holding out hope that he hadn’t meant that was his final career goal.

However, Kasserine, if that’s the most “realistic career expectation” (I have to agree with you on this - at least for those who choose to gain their flight experience via the standard civilian path), then why on earth would they do it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasserine06

It is not pretty, but at least you won’t be bitter when you are 45 and still in a CRJ when you realize that your dream to make captain at a major before you retire is out of the question. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best.

If it’s “not pretty”, the most realistic end result is something to be bitter over at age 45 and realization of a “dream” is impossible before you start, then why do it? Why would anyone enter any career where they have to “plan for the worst” outcome? Having realistic goals is one thing but “planning for the worst”????
It’s one thing to have entered into an RJ job years ago when it was viewed as a stepping stone – experience building position which will make pilots competitive for a good flying job where they can establish a long-term career.
If I pilot accepts that job now, knowing it’s where he’s going to finish, I really have to question his judgment.

I’ll bet that most young “wannabes” still hold that glimmer of hope when they accept that RJ job. They still think “not me” - “I’ll be here a few years and pay my dues, then I’ll get a better job”. “I’ll be the one to win the lottery”. Some will, if they have the right contacts, the right timing, etc. Most won’t. If they really BELIEVED in their gut that this was the final stop in their career, I think many would think twice. Unfortunately, even if they do think twice, many have made their bed already. They’ve paid boo-coo dollars to some college with an aviation program or some pilot factory promising a great career. Now they have big debt, pilot ratings w/ no experience and the only thing they feel like they can do is enter “the matrix”, plug in and hope things get better someday. It ain’t lookin’ real good for that any time soon.

So, the key is to reach them at this guy’s age – while they’re still in high school and haven’t decided. Really educate them about the reality before they commit to an expensive education path that’s going to lead them to a point where they feel they have no choice and have to continue because they’ve spent so much buying their ratings, etc.

It’s not going to be any easier for him to get a fighter pilot job or any flying position in the military for that matter – but at least he won’t go into debt pursuing it. If he really wants to be a fighter pilot, he shouldn’t limit himself to the Guard. He needs to look at all avenues – active duty USAF, Navy, Marines. Either he wants it or he doesn’t. There are not many fighter pilots on the planet who have pursued that dream with caveats like “I’m only going to be a fighter pilot if I can be in my home state, near my family and my dream airline hub”.

 

I gave the guy the benefit of the doubt...assumed that he did not plan to stay at PCL as a CA, but was planning on moving on. If that wasn't his plan...well, he would figure it out along the way

It is worth noting that there are better regionals than PCL. Even if your hometown is their domicile, there are no guarantees that a regional will not change bases with 30 days notice.

Also, the ANG is going to lose a lot of fighters and gain a lot of UAV's. If you want to fly a manned airplane, heavy transports might be a safer bet.