Yup.

The comment you refer to is typical of those who have only seen one side of the fence...or who feel the need to buff up their self-image.

That kind of comment really makes me chuckle. When I was doing Captain upgrade line instruction, the absolute worst student I ever had was this retired USAF B-52 pilot and former squadron commander (a position he seemed to never tire in reminding me of). If managing a crew in all of its complexity was supposed to build better CRM skills, this guy missed the boat a long time ago.

Other than that, to answer the original question...previous experience in this regard counts for little to nothing. I often was asked as a new hire what I thought about the differences between an airline cockpit and fighters. My thinking then and now is that it all depends on the individual's personality. Some fit in well, some don't...just like others from different backgrounds.

 

ejoachim-

You've probably gotten all the advice you need from this thread and other pilots you've talked to, but I'll throw in my .02 anyway. I say always keep as many options open as possible, so go UPT instead of ENJJPT.

A lot of guys have made the very valid point that you can only find the supersonic, pulling g's, tactical fighter flying in the military, and that if you choose heavies you might regret it later. That's absolutely true. However, it's also true that that type of flying isn't right for everybody. In my UPT class, 25 out of 28 of us raised our hand on day 1 when our flt/cc asked us how many wanted to fly fighters. But 6 months later, on track select day, only about 10 people were still competing for the 6 T-38's in our drop. The rest had decided they wanted to fly heavies because they wanted to see the world, because g forces hurt their a$$, or because they were just too laid back for the intense fighter lifestyle.

If you're being offered an ENJJPT slot, then I'm sure you're smart enough, motivated enough, and talented enough to be near the top of your UPT class and get a T-38 if you still want it. So I say you should get a taste of military flying, talk to lots of IPs with different backgrounds, and give yourself the option to fly any plane in the Air Force inventory. Who knows, you might decide that helicopters are your top chioce.

 

Lifestyle, lifestyle, lifestyle. pick one that suits your lifestyle. Im lazy, love to travel, and love working with big crews. So Heavies was the way to go for me. If you fly fighters youll definitly have fun, but youll miss out on those lovely 2 week trips touring through Europe, no overnights in Honolulu, etc. If you want to see the world, go heavies. if you want to pull G's and study all the time and do all that stuff, then go fighters.


No one way is better than the other i think, its just about what you want. All i know is, when im 40, im going to feel a lot better about stepping into the cockpit of a C-17 as a reservist than an F-16, but hey some people age better than others.

As for the AF as a stepping stone for the airlines, this is where i might disagree with others. The airlines has ALWAYS been my passion. There is no problem in my opinion of serving honorably in the AF, doing your job well, and then moving on to the airlines. The military is an awesome deal and its extremely rewarding. Even if thats your intention from the beginning, then thats your perogative. Dont let anyone intimidate you. The first thing i said my first day at the Air Force Academy was "I want to be an Airline Pilot." Looking back at that, yes, it wasnt wise, but hey i was being honest. And I did my active duty time well, and now as a reservist im proud of what ive done, and i get to do what i wanted to do on both sides. Even at UPT i wouldnt hide it, youll know who the cool instructors are and who you can talk to about stuff like that. Good luck to you!

 

It's been an excellent thread and I agree with it all.................... Bottom line, do you want to be TOPGUN or TOPBUNK.

 

I agree with it, too. Except for this last comment. What a tool. I'm sure you're a blast to be on the road with. I can see it now: "Did I mention I was a Naval Aviator Fighter Pilot? Since you weren't, I'd better take this leg. Now, did I ever tell you about the night trap I had on the Enterprise? I did? Well, how about when it took my entire division to gun that WIC grad? That one too, huh? Well, it's only 8 hours to Narita, just enough time to tell you how we all got naked in the ready room when I first crossed the equator..."

 

Duece: I DID do all those things......and no you cannot have the leg to Subic

Did not mean to hurt anyone's feelings so I'll go back and capitalize bunk in my earlier post

 

I'd say you are making a classic tactical error right now. First try to drop out of your ROTC commitment and get picked up by a reserve or guard unit for UPT. They are currently waiving USAFA commitments so you should be able to get out of ROTC. Next if you want to fly airlines, find a world wide large plane unit that will send you to UPT ASAP. Then hit the road. We have numerous pilots in our unit that we have sent to UPT who are now flying with FDX/UPS/SWA all hired within the last four years and all less than 5 years from UPT to a line number.

If you want to be the coolest cat on the block, go pointy. There is no substitute for speed. You will never regret the flying. The pointy world is dog eat dog and no holds bar'd. And it must be that way...you know the best of the best. You will not be an excellent instument pilot, your idea of ICAO jeps is to call the SOF, your knowledge of working the system will be limited to whatever region you are based or where ever your boat is. But! you will be able to quickly and decisively make timely decisions. A quality that heavy flying will breed out of you. Heavy flying will breed a great worldwide experience, good familiarity with lots of other contries procedures, and an appreciation of hot meals. But!, you will be slow to make decisions, and when faced with a tough call you will want to discuss it with someone (CRM). Good and Bad either way, but if you truely KNOW what you want then go directly for it. Twenty or thirty years in the Guard or Reserves is also an outstanding career and the fastest way to a line number.

PS in the Reserves you can always go heavy until you get hired at a major then go AETC for some pretend pointy time then try for a fighter unit. Not a great probability but if you want something...get-er-done.

 

Where was home, Shreveport or Minot?

 

try interviewing with the C-17 units they are standing up in Travis CA and Anchorage AK. Theres also Honolulu but thats a pretty good ole boy network. If you dont mind flying KC135's you can probably get hired at any of their locations

 

I wanted heavies, the airlines, and to be out by 7 years as a captain. I likewise passed on Euro-NATO...never even applied for a slot although I'd have been competitive.

So--roll the tape. I've flown the OV-10 and the F-15 since 1992...flew 2 ops tours, an FTU tour, and now fly part time. I got silver oak leaves on my flight suit that still make me laugh out loud--sort of the "ship in a bottle" thought of "how did those get here?". I wouldn't change one dang thing...

I was smart enough in UPT to pretty much keep my mouth shut about my Delta dreams, and also to keep an open mind. I didn't think I'd like sucking air out of can wearing a helment. I was wrong. I didn't think I'd like spending my time studying tactics and crap--I wanted to go see the world. In the end--I did both. I don't think my globe holds a candle to some C-130 drivers out there--never been to Diego, Wake, Ascension, or Johnston Islands...although I always wanted to. However--my gosh--the stuff I DID get to do rocked and I've enjoyed every bit of it. A common thread to my decisions to stay in and keep plugging were good leaders who made working and serving feel like the right thing to do.

I meet a lot of pilots in my gig. I've met airline pilots who dropped bombs in Iraqi Freedom when they got activated. I've met special ops guys who's stories would stop you in your tracks when you hear about low level missions in Afgahanistan. I met a P-3 driver who flew some of the bodies from the USS Cole bombing out of theater to bring them to be transported home with honor. I don't think loving your country and wanting to serve as a pilot require you to pick an airframe or a time committment. The military needs 20 year and 30 year officers. It also needs folks to come in and serve and get the hell out--we can't all be 4 star generals.

So--I wanted heavies and got fighters. I wanted to be out by 30 and I'm still flying fighters at 41. Life has a way of throwing stuff at you that you didn't expect. I just took a break from this post to take help my 3 year old change a Barbie dress...another of life's little blessings I never saw coming. Open your mind, shut your mouth, bust your a$$, and take a little pride in whatever you do. Buff, Herc, Eagle, Viper, Hornet, Cod, or Blackhawk...you won't be working in a cubicle and you will be making a difference. And if it counts--on this Veteran's Day--I for one will appreciate your service.