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Old 05-12-2024 | 02:16 PM
  #131  
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Why is the question even on the application? Strike it. Drop the whole thing.
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Old 05-12-2024 | 02:25 PM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by KevinGrey400
My medical record from the DoD is 1232 hard earned pages. You shouldnt be flippant.
I was joking with CX500T, if he's offended he can let me know.
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Old 05-12-2024 | 02:27 PM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by METO Guido
Why is the question even on the application? Strike it. Drop the whole thing.
Because if people are collecting disability payments, it's most likely for something which should be reported to the FAA.

And it gives them legal probable cause to subpoena records when they find somebody who's getting $ from another gov agency but didn't check the box.
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Old 05-12-2024 | 02:32 PM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by KevinGrey400
My medical record from the DoD is 1232 hard earned pages. You shouldnt be flippant.
pretty sure he was kidding
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Old 05-12-2024 | 02:35 PM
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Originally Posted by KevinGrey400
My medical record from the DoD is 1232 hard earned pages. You shouldnt be flippant.
May be a shocker to you, but the size of your med jacket has no bearing on anything. A large file could be taken many ways. May not be the flex you're intending to everyone here.
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Old 05-12-2024 | 03:20 PM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by rickair7777
Because if people are collecting disability payments, it's most likely for something which should be reported to the FAA.

And it gives them legal probable cause to subpoena records when they find somebody who's getting $ from another gov agency but didn't check the box.
I know. But they’re using data access for a purpose it was never intended. If you answer the basic what’s wrong w you every 6, who cares?
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Old 05-12-2024 | 03:39 PM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by 60av8tor
May be a shocker to you, but the size of your med jacket has no bearing on anything. A large file could be taken many ways. May not be the flex you're intending to everyone here.
exactly. Works both ways
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Old 07-01-2024 | 06:54 AM
  #138  
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To pick up where last left off, and in particular to those who think the FAA world revolves around persecuting former military (veterans), a reminder that enforcement for failure to report benefits covers far more than just VA benefits. AOPA reports on the case of a seventy-one year old retired USAF colonel who pled guilty to fraudulent claim of social security benefits, and was also conficted of three counts of making falsle statements to the FAA; the conviction was in federal court, by jury, not merely an FAA administrative action. The subject defrauded both the VA and the Social Security Administration, though most charges were dropped by plea, with one guilty plea for the social security, and restitution of some one hundred forty thousand and change. The jury conviction wasn't for the theft from the government, but for lying to the FAA, specificly failure to report disability benefits. The seventy-one year old was one of those discovered by the VA investigation that was pressed into the FAA's hands. It moved beyond an administrative action, to criminal charges. The retired colonel was found to have not lied to the FAA by error, but by intent, hence, the conviction.

The subject was facing up to five years in prison per charge, and a quarter of a million dollar fine per charge, which led him to plead down to the single charge of social securities fraud. He did wind up with a three year sentence (supervised release), and eight hundrd fifty thousand in fines.

https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2024/june/13/pilot-sentenced-for-lying-on-faa-medical-applications?utm_source=epilot&utm_medium=email

It's worth mentioning because discovery of failure to disclose goes far beyond a slap on the wrist or even a certificate suspension. It can get a lot worse, to include criminal federal charges, jail time, and big fines, and it can extend beyond your flying career years. Nothing with which to toy around.

From AMAS (Aviation Medicine Advisory Service) today, in their email news blast (no link because email):

The February FAA Safety Briefing contained an aeromedical advisory update from the FAA Federal Air Surgeon, Dr. Susan Northrup, regarding airmen reporting obligations for receiving medical disability benefits which can be found here. Dr. Northrup notes that in addition to VA disability, airmen need to report “any form of disability benefit, including from a private insurer, workers’ compensation, or Social Security disability”. Furthermore, when dealing with service-connected VA ratings, “even a 0% disability rating should be reported” on the FAA’s MedXpress application (FAA Form 8500-8). Remember that the FAA is concerned with the condition and treatment rather than the amount of compensation. There are many airmen with 100% VA disability ratings who have been cleared by the FAA. AOPA recently reported sentencing of a retired USAF Colonel who was given 6 months of home confinement, 3 years probation, and $850,000 in fines, for fraudulent medical applications.
The linked article above by. Susan Northrup (https://medium.com/faa/reporting-disability-compensation-6b432fd3b8ce) is worth reviewing:

Reporting Disability Compensation

By Dr. Susan Northrop, FAA Flight Surgeon

Recently, there has been a lot of discussion in many different forums regarding the FAA and pilots who receive disability compensation, especially from the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA). Some pilots are concerned that a high disability rating can jeopardize medical certification. This is not true. Our determination is based on the condition and treatment, not the amount of compensation. While the likelihood of a significant medical issue does increase with a higher rating, the correlation is not as strong as you might think. In fact, we have pilots who have a 100% disability rating from the VA, yet qualify for a Class I or II medical. On the other hand, some conditions, such as a seizure disorder, can have a rating from the VA, as low as 10%, yet not be safe for flight. For this reason, even a 0% disability rating should be reported. I want to emphasize though that we consider each pilot individually with the goal of issuing a medical when it is safe to do so.

I would like to address the responsibility that we pilots have for reporting disability compensation on the FAA medical application (FAA Form 8500–8). I would also like to remind you that you need to report any form of disability benefit, including from a private insurer, workers’ compensation, or Social Security disability.

Question 18y, Medical Disability Benefits, is answered incorrectly by many pilots. The purpose of providing medical history on the 8500–8 form through MedXPress is to identify areas of potential aeromedical concern and to ensure adequate and aeromedically acceptable mitigation. Sometimes these concerns can be addressed by the aviation medical examiner (AME) while you are in the office, and you leave with your medical in hand; other times additional information and testing might be necessary to ensure aviation safety. This is just as true for a history of medical disability benefits as any medical condition.

Why are we concerned about pilots receiving medical disability? The short answer is that even though pilots should annotate their medical conditions in other parts of question 18, they may not believe that an underlying medical condition or treatment falls within another question on FAA form 8500–8. Additionally, question 18y can serve as a helpful reminder of medical conditions that the applicant did not think about when answering other parts of question 18. Remember that our goal is to ensure the safety of the national airspace system. This question helps us ensure that all underlying medical conditions are disclosed, adequately controlled (or resolved), and that the treatment is aeromedically acceptable.

For those of you who have been granted disability compensation since your last medical application, I recommend that you gather the paperwork you have for that disability compensation and bring it with you to show your AME at your next FAA medical examination. If it’s a VA disability, bring the VA decision letter(s). Consider making an appointment with your AME prior to the examination to review the information for completeness. For those of you who have been granted disability compensation prior to your last FAA medical but did not report it, I recommend that you provide this to the FAA now even if you are not due for an examination. Your AME can help with this. Make sure that you bring copies of all the disability evaluations, not just the most recent ones. This will expedite your review.

Should your disability compensation change, you will also need to report this. Generally, you will do so at the time of your next medical application. Second, independent of any reporting requirements, remember your obligations under 14 CFR section 61.53. The bottom line is that question 18y is like any other question about medical history. We simply want to ensure that the underlying condition is well-controlled and that the treatment is aeromedically acceptable.

Dr. Susan Northrup received a bachelor’s degree in chemistry, a medical degree from The Ohio State University, and a master’s degree in public health from the University of Texas. She is double board-certified by the American Board of Preventive Medicine in Aerospace Medicine and Occupational Medicine. She is a retired U.S. Air Force colonel and a former regional medical director for Delta Air Lines. She is also an active private pilot.

Last edited by JohnBurke; 07-01-2024 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 07-04-2024 | 04:27 PM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by CX500T
I got a letter of investigation. I had my medical revoked.

I had my medical reinstated only after getting a Congresswoman , AMAS and lawyers involved.

Cost me over $19k not counting missed work when green slips were raining.

I never lied/hid/nothing.

I got nothing resembling due process.
Dude you need to lawyer up and sue the pants off the FAA---and for like 10X more than what it actually cost. It would be very easy to find a line-up of attorneys ready to take that on esp since 1) Your damages are quantative 2) the FAA has deep pockets. 3) They found you didnt violate any regs (of course).

The combo of those 3 would make that very attractive to many attorneys. Sure as hell hope you got on that if you havent already.

If the UAL pilot got a $300K settlement from the city of Denver in 2019 after being falsely arrested for indecency at the airport hotel, then theres no question that this is equally unjust and deserves the same or greater legal remedy.

Last edited by Bahamasflyer; 07-04-2024 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 07-04-2024 | 10:56 PM
  #140  
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Originally Posted by Bahamasflyer
Dude you need to lawyer up and sue the pants off the FAA---and for like 10X more than what it actually cost. It would be very easy to find a line-up of attorneys ready to take that on esp since 1) Your damages are quantative 2) the FAA has deep pockets. 3) They found you didnt violate any regs (of course).

The combo of those 3 would make that very attractive to many attorneys. Sure as hell hope you got on that if you havent already.

If the UAL pilot got a $300K settlement from the city of Denver in 2019 after being falsely arrested for indecency at the airport hotel, then theres no question that this is equally unjust and deserves the same or greater legal remedy.
Administrative law is not the same as civil or criminal law. There is no presumption of innocence.

One's first opportunity to take legal action to defend one's self is at the appeal process. First comes the conviction, then the accused may seek to prove himself or herself not liable.

The FAA doesn't have deep pockets.

Under civil law, just about anyone can sue just about anyone; there are limits on the ability to sue the government, however; especially when the government has acted within the scope of it's duty. Whether it acted properly or not, it still may be a tough row to hoe. One can try, but one also faces considerable cost in making the effort. A UAL pilot suing a city is not the same thing as suing the FAA for an administrative enforcement action. Further, the FAA does not owe any pilot a medical certificate. If the FAA states that medical privileges are suspended pending additional documentation, a pilot does not have a right to that certificate, and is obligated to meet what burden the FAA requires, to show compliance. The FAA is not obligated to issue pilot or medical certification. It's a privilege, not a right.

I recently burned up all my sick time, and vacation time, until I met the burden required by the FAA with regard to documentation, plus the time required to go through the process until approval, and am now on a special issuance. Ironically, all my medical testing presently shows me outside the boundaries to define that medical issue. In other words, my medical documentation shows that the reason for which I have a special issuance does not exist for me. Never the less, I have a recurring duty now to get all the testing and certification, in order to get my medical, going forward. I'm now required to demonstrate not that I'm okay to fly with that condition, but that I don't have it. Go figure. It costs. It takes time. It requires a roundup of tests and appointments and various physicians. I have no more vacation or sick time to fall back on, and burned up savings. Never the less, I do not have a case to make against the FAA. The FAA determined that additional testing and documentation was required, determined that a special issuance was in order, and thus it went. I can't turn around and sue on the basis that it cost me time or money; the FAA does not owe me a medical, nor do I have a right to the certificate. I am required to meet whatever documentation, testing and medical evidence is required, to satisfy the FAA, and that's what's been done. Shortly, with another medical coming up, that's what's going to be done again. My expense, not the FAA's. That's reality.

If you're familiar with the Bob Hoover story, you'll have an idea of the expenses that can attend a fight to restore privileges, when the FAA takes aim. Even such a high profile event with some of the most high-profile attorneys in the business backing the fight, it was uphill and an extremely expensive multi-million dollar path for one of the best known most widely respected, and beloved pilots on the planet and all he did was the airshow routine he was approved to fly. That event can be torn up and down in discussion and has been, many times over, but when it comes to the FAA seeking additional data for the medical, or doing an emergency revocation, or anything in beetween, it's not simply a matter of the FAA having deep pockets, and coulda, woulda, shoulda have sued.
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