Will having my ATP help or hurt me?
05-13-2024, 01:43 PM
#71
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Joined APC: Sep 2016
Position: Paahlot
Posts: 4,148
Originally Posted by 121noob
Forgive me if I don't just blindly trust random anonymous and unaccountable people on an internet chat forum
- Forgive me for not understanding
- Forgive me for not understanding
05-13-2024, 01:44 PM
#72
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Joined APC: Oct 2023
Position: 135 SIC
Posts: 193
Originally Posted by prayforwaves117
skywest now does also as of this week. There’s another thread about it https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/skywest/147213-skywest-first-officer-advancement-agreement.html
05-13-2024, 01:59 PM
#73
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Joined APC: Jul 2019
Posts: 424
I haven’t really been following this thread. But I understand there’s been a question about PIC time. I think this is what some people are getting at. This comes from the FEDEX careers page. I remember Delta and southwest use to have a very similar statement:
Q11: How does FedEx define Pilot in Command (PIC)?
A11: For minimum qualification purposes, PIC is defined as Captain/Aircraft Commander of record, not simply the sole manipulator of the controls. FedEx considers only pilot time in fixed wing aircraft toward minimum qualifications, and does not include simulator, helicopter, flight engineer, bombardier, navigator, RIO, EWO, WSO, NFO, or Special Crew.
https://careers.fedex.com/pilot-faq
I think this is what some individuals are trying to explain.
Q11: How does FedEx define Pilot in Command (PIC)?
A11: For minimum qualification purposes, PIC is defined as Captain/Aircraft Commander of record, not simply the sole manipulator of the controls. FedEx considers only pilot time in fixed wing aircraft toward minimum qualifications, and does not include simulator, helicopter, flight engineer, bombardier, navigator, RIO, EWO, WSO, NFO, or Special Crew.
https://careers.fedex.com/pilot-faq
I think this is what some individuals are trying to explain.
05-13-2024, 02:05 PM
#74
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Joined APC: Jan 2021
Position: We Need To Talk About Your Flare
Posts: 591
Originally Posted by 121noob
Next question
What about part 91 legs where I am sole manipulator?
What about part 91 legs where I am sole manipulator?
What do you think my answer is going to be?
05-13-2024, 02:26 PM
#75
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Posts: 188
Originally Posted by 121noob
The only regional requiring a training contract at the moment is Republic, right?
05-13-2024, 02:30 PM
#76
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Posts: 188
Originally Posted by 121noob
Forgive me if I don't just blindly trust random anonymous and unaccountable people on an internet chat forum
Funny thing is right after this post, you ask another question of "Random anonymous and unaccountable people". Why bother asking?
05-13-2024, 02:39 PM
#77
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Posts: 188
Here is the bottom line in a nutshell. If you need that "logged PIC" time to count towards ATP mins, many airlines will not even interview you because they have a thousand applications where they dont have ANY questions. They dont have enough time to call/interview people with questionable times. If you DONT need those hours to count towards ATP mins, then log it as SIC time, it doesnt hurt you. I flew right seat in a single pilot jet, did not have opspec to log it. I DID log the time because I wanted to show, A. Why I have an SIC rating and B. I have some jet time so I understand the FLight Level environment. To be clear, this time was NOT required for my ATP as I already had the ATP mins met. Nobody had a problem with it being "logged"
05-14-2024, 01:24 AM
#78
Reserve Without End
Joined APC: Feb 2022
Posts: 146
Originally Posted by followingdreams
So if random anonymous and unaccoutable people said it was ok to do what you are doing, THEN you would listen?
Funny thing is right after this post, you ask another question of "Random anonymous and unaccountable people". Why bother asking?
Funny thing is right after this post, you ask another question of "Random anonymous and unaccountable people". Why bother asking?
05-14-2024, 06:17 AM
#79
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Originally Posted by QRH Bingo
Why are you making this so difficult? It's like you're desperately stretching to show potential employers you have PIC time when it is not how they define it.
What do you think my answer is going to be?
What do you think my answer is going to be?
But for all part 121 jobs they are looking for it is exactly as you said, the person who was assigned PIC on the release.
05-14-2024, 08:04 AM
#80
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Joined APC: Apr 2022
Posts: 253
Originally Posted by 121noob
Next question
What about part 91 legs where I am sole manipulator?
What about part 91 legs where I am sole manipulator?
If you are worried about having enough PIC time for an ATP, review the requirements here:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/61.
159
Note that clicking on the hyperlinked pilot in command takes you to the FAR Part 1 definition of PIC:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/index.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id= 85212e95e8f157e5a26ba0cd5671237d&term_occur=999&te rm_src=Title:14:Chapter:I:Subchapter
:Part:61:Sub part:G:61.159So your sole manipulator time counts towards ATP requirements but airlines want to see only that FAR Part 1.1 definition of PIC time.
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