Bored
07-24-2007 | 08:04 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 379
Likes: 0
From: Part 121, 135 & Military background
JJ.
first off, you're not JUST waiting, you're learning. Since you posted that you are in your 30's and have owned a business, you should realize that. I learn something ever time I go fly and I'm on my 18th year as a pilot. I've forgotten all that private pilot/CFI stuff, but I do know what makes an airline run on time, how to serve my passengers, how to get the most out of my crew.
The challenge is not "get called by a legacy" but rather to earn the right to be a captain, gain the experience and finally make the decision if staying where you're at or going to a legacy is right for you. By then you will earned the right to sit at that XYZ interview. I absolutely guarantee their are many things to challenge your intellect, and it has little to do with how "well you fly"
Start thinking like a Captain, learn your FOM (or Op Spec), know what you're doing and why. If all these things still don't do it for you, and it's possible it won't, then you should consider going back to an enviroment that let's your aggressive and creative side flurish.
Stick
first off, you're not JUST waiting, you're learning. Since you posted that you are in your 30's and have owned a business, you should realize that. I learn something ever time I go fly and I'm on my 18th year as a pilot. I've forgotten all that private pilot/CFI stuff, but I do know what makes an airline run on time, how to serve my passengers, how to get the most out of my crew.
The challenge is not "get called by a legacy" but rather to earn the right to be a captain, gain the experience and finally make the decision if staying where you're at or going to a legacy is right for you. By then you will earned the right to sit at that XYZ interview. I absolutely guarantee their are many things to challenge your intellect, and it has little to do with how "well you fly"
Start thinking like a Captain, learn your FOM (or Op Spec), know what you're doing and why. If all these things still don't do it for you, and it's possible it won't, then you should consider going back to an enviroment that let's your aggressive and creative side flurish.
Stick
07-24-2007 | 08:13 AM
#13
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 45,129
Likes: 796
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
AV8ER
I guess you don't have much feedback to offer. I didn't post this to start some sort of pi$$ing match. By the way, I have read Flying the Line. I presume most pilots have a type A personality. I was curious how many people in this profession no longer felt like sitting around and waiting for good things to happen. I personally feel the need to be proactive towards my goals. I have a feeling there are many of you that feel the same way.
My problem is bigger than just the seniority system which a couple of you have chosen to focus on. The overall decisions of where this industry is going as far as pay, quality of service (example Jet Airways service vs. Southwest) mergers government intervention (TSA & DHS) ect. We are pretty much at the mercy of management the government, and our fellow aviators when it comes to our future. To clarify the comment on fellow aviators I meant as far as what wages people will work for.
Again I enjoy my job but I can't bear the idea of being out of control of my own destiny any longer.
I guess you don't have much feedback to offer. I didn't post this to start some sort of pi$$ing match. By the way, I have read Flying the Line. I presume most pilots have a type A personality. I was curious how many people in this profession no longer felt like sitting around and waiting for good things to happen. I personally feel the need to be proactive towards my goals. I have a feeling there are many of you that feel the same way.
My problem is bigger than just the seniority system which a couple of you have chosen to focus on. The overall decisions of where this industry is going as far as pay, quality of service (example Jet Airways service vs. Southwest) mergers government intervention (TSA & DHS) ect. We are pretty much at the mercy of management the government, and our fellow aviators when it comes to our future. To clarify the comment on fellow aviators I meant as far as what wages people will work for.
Again I enjoy my job but I can't bear the idea of being out of control of my own destiny any longer.
I considered everything you mentioned when I changed careers. The kicker for me was flexibility...if I have an outside job that becomes less-than-enjoyable I'm not stuck there just to pay the bills. Once you get off reserve you should have enough time off to pursue something else on the side. These are examples of pilot off-duty activities..they all share one common trait, they can be done with flexible hours or even from a laptop on the road:
Military reserve
Real estate
Slum Lord
Buy Homes and fix them up for resale
Small Retail Business Owner
Computer Support for Small Busineses
Contract Computer Programmer
Restore Old cars
Tile, cabinet installation, etc
Writer
Various Artistic Things
DJ
Musician
Install/Setup complex home intertainment systems
Install home internet systems
Light Commercial Diving (clean / repair small boats)
Teacher/Instructor (endless list of possibilities)
Teach Ground Schools at the local FBO/school
Etc,etc
Each of those examples represent someone I know. I didn't list day-trader because everybody I know who tried that lost their @ss.
Most of these jobs can also be scaled up to support you if you get furloughed.
You could also do volunteer work.
07-24-2007 | 04:52 PM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 187
Likes: 0
This is the only problem I have with aviation and why I probably won't ever go work for the airlines. Your whole career is based on a senority number. Unlike some jobs, were the most productive and hard working will get promotions, pilots are at the mercy of a senority number. You just have to sit and wait and hope that someones leaves or retires so that you can move up. Everyone is on the same playing field so it doesn't really matter if your a better employee or not. Now that airline pay and quality of life is in the dumpster it makes it harder for pilots to wait around for that next year pay. Maybe you would have been better off just pursuing general aviation.
07-24-2007 | 05:36 PM
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 574
Likes: 0
So.... I have been doing the regional FO gear slinger thing for coming up on one year now. I am in my 30's, so I have had a life before aviation. I have been persuing ”The Dream" for the last 6 years. I had a bumpy road getting to where I am now. I like my job for the most part. My problem is I feel like my life is all about waiting now. I am waiting to get off reserve, waiting for 2nd year pay, waiting for upgrade, waiting for the Legacy carriers to call ect. ect.
Prior to aviation I ran my own small business. Every day I thought of things I could do to advance my business. I was free to act on my ideas and suffer the consequences if I failed or reap the bennies is I succeeded. These days I can only wait for my seniority number to go up. I can study all I want and do everything I can to be the best pilot I can be, however I won't receive a penny for it til the next year of my service begins or til enough people move on ahead of me and I can upgrade.
I am not whining about my job. Again, I do enjoy what I do. I feel as though I am wasting away waiting for the next big thing to happen and feel I have nothing to say about it.
I want to start another business and take back control of my life again. I can't wait until I save up some money so I can get out of this business. It isn't what I thought it would be. I know I can't live like this for another 30 years.
Anybody else feel this way?
Prior to aviation I ran my own small business. Every day I thought of things I could do to advance my business. I was free to act on my ideas and suffer the consequences if I failed or reap the bennies is I succeeded. These days I can only wait for my seniority number to go up. I can study all I want and do everything I can to be the best pilot I can be, however I won't receive a penny for it til the next year of my service begins or til enough people move on ahead of me and I can upgrade.
I am not whining about my job. Again, I do enjoy what I do. I feel as though I am wasting away waiting for the next big thing to happen and feel I have nothing to say about it.
I want to start another business and take back control of my life again. I can't wait until I save up some money so I can get out of this business. It isn't what I thought it would be. I know I can't live like this for another 30 years.
Anybody else feel this way?
07-24-2007 | 06:38 PM
#18
Freightmama!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,880
Likes: 0
From: 757/767 FO
07-24-2007 | 06:40 PM
#19
Freightmama!
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,880
Likes: 0
From: 757/767 FO
This is the only problem I have with aviation and why I probably won't ever go work for the airlines. Your whole career is based on a senority number. Unlike some jobs, were the most productive and hard working will get promotions, pilots are at the mercy of a senority number. You just have to sit and wait and hope that someones leaves or retires so that you can move up. Everyone is on the same playing field so it doesn't really matter if your a better employee or not. Now that airline pay and quality of life is in the dumpster it makes it harder for pilots to wait around for that next year pay. Maybe you would have been better off just pursuing general aviation.
And of course the problem of the chief pilot's buddies would be annoying as well.
07-24-2007 | 06:54 PM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,934
Likes: 0
From: Retired
Guys I have a serious question I would like answered but this isn't a flame fest so please don't start with me.
My brother-in-law belongs to a union. If he for some reason loses his job, he can simply go to the union hall, and if there is a need, go to the next job site and retain his pay and seniority number.
So my question is why do the airline unions work differently?
If the answer is in Flying the Line Part 1 or 2 I apologize. I haven't had time to read them yet.
I'm just curious since I'm new to all of this.
The Chow
My brother-in-law belongs to a union. If he for some reason loses his job, he can simply go to the union hall, and if there is a need, go to the next job site and retain his pay and seniority number.
So my question is why do the airline unions work differently?
If the answer is in Flying the Line Part 1 or 2 I apologize. I haven't had time to read them yet.
I'm just curious since I'm new to all of this.
The Chow
My old man is in the machinist union. If his employer were to cut his position he could bump somebody based on lower seniortiy but this wouldn't apply to say, Boeing as well. Even though they're all machinists, and in the same city, they belong to different locals and have different CBAs.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
