Colgan Pilot Development Program
03-11-2008, 09:53 PM
#61
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: XJT furloughed due to non-ALPA undercutting
Posts: 376
For anyone that thinks a regional is a regional, PM me your email address and I will send you a copy of the XJT pilot contract which has been referred to as industry leading for the RJ. It's a large attachment, 419 pages to be exact.
After checking it out hopefully you will think 'wow, I guess all regionals aren't the same.'
...because they arent. While you are 'building time' (a flight school term) you are flying hundreds passengers a day from city to city, creating profit for your airline, and million dollar paychecks for your CEOs at your respective codeshare. Colgan isn't a time building scheme, its a business that needs to be respected. An ILS down to mins in a 737 is the same as a Q400, so stop rationalizing that 'it's just a regional' less. Why do I care? I care because for every dude that wants to come in and do my job for less, undercut our contract and put my job in jeopardy needs to realize thats not right.
Do you think your passengers and their loved ones want the pilots up front to be 'building time' thinking about their dream legacy job, or to be 'flying professionally' ? Express, Connection, Airlink, whatever, you do the same job as mainline so start thinking like it, and stop undercutting it. Does United have a United Pilot Development Program?
After checking it out hopefully you will think 'wow, I guess all regionals aren't the same.'
...because they arent. While you are 'building time' (a flight school term) you are flying hundreds passengers a day from city to city, creating profit for your airline, and million dollar paychecks for your CEOs at your respective codeshare. Colgan isn't a time building scheme, its a business that needs to be respected. An ILS down to mins in a 737 is the same as a Q400, so stop rationalizing that 'it's just a regional' less. Why do I care? I care because for every dude that wants to come in and do my job for less, undercut our contract and put my job in jeopardy needs to realize thats not right.
Do you think your passengers and their loved ones want the pilots up front to be 'building time' thinking about their dream legacy job, or to be 'flying professionally' ? Express, Connection, Airlink, whatever, you do the same job as mainline so start thinking like it, and stop undercutting it. Does United have a United Pilot Development Program?
Last edited by N2rotation; 03-11-2008 at 09:56 PM. Reason: addition
03-12-2008, 04:34 AM
#62
On Reserve
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: SAAB 340 F/O
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by jamin35008
The the F@#& people????? All I wanted to know is if anyone has been through the program? I didnt ask if you think Colgan sucks or not. I think Eagle sucks, but thats because Ive been with the company for 7yrs and know how they work, but Im not bashing anyone asking info on Eagle! to each there own and if you cant say something constructive leave it alone!
By the way THANK YOU Greenlantern for the info! I see you cant private message yet...can I e-mail you some questions?
By the way THANK YOU Greenlantern for the info! I see you cant private message yet...can I e-mail you some questions?
03-12-2008, 04:36 AM
#63
On Reserve
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: SAAB 340 F/O
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by greenlantern
Sure thing Jamin. my email address is [email protected]
03-12-2008, 06:29 AM
#64
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 737 Left
Posts: 828
Originally Posted by N2rotation
For anyone that thinks a regional is a regional, PM me your email address and I will send you a copy of the XJT pilot contract which has been referred to as industry leading for the RJ. It's a large attachment, 419 pages to be exact.
After checking it out hopefully you will think 'wow, I guess all regionals aren't the same.'
...because they arent. While you are 'building time' (a flight school term) you are flying hundreds passengers a day from city to city, creating profit for your airline, and million dollar paychecks for your CEOs at your respective codeshare. Colgan isn't a time building scheme, its a business that needs to be respected. An ILS down to mins in a 737 is the same as a Q400, so stop rationalizing that 'it's just a regional' less. Why do I care? I care because for every dude that wants to come in and do my job for less, undercut our contract and put my job in jeopardy needs to realize thats not right.
Do you think your passengers and their loved ones want the pilots up front to be 'building time' thinking about their dream legacy job, or to be 'flying professionally' ? Express, Connection, Airlink, whatever, you do the same job as mainline so start thinking like it, and stop undercutting it. Does United have a United Pilot Development Program?
After checking it out hopefully you will think 'wow, I guess all regionals aren't the same.'
...because they arent. While you are 'building time' (a flight school term) you are flying hundreds passengers a day from city to city, creating profit for your airline, and million dollar paychecks for your CEOs at your respective codeshare. Colgan isn't a time building scheme, its a business that needs to be respected. An ILS down to mins in a 737 is the same as a Q400, so stop rationalizing that 'it's just a regional' less. Why do I care? I care because for every dude that wants to come in and do my job for less, undercut our contract and put my job in jeopardy needs to realize thats not right.
Do you think your passengers and their loved ones want the pilots up front to be 'building time' thinking about their dream legacy job, or to be 'flying professionally' ? Express, Connection, Airlink, whatever, you do the same job as mainline so start thinking like it, and stop undercutting it. Does United have a United Pilot Development Program?
Not to mention you're flying mainline routes for regional pay with regards to your branded operation.
You think you've got a great contract over there, but you don't understand that your management is taking complete advantage of you. $60/hour to fly from SAT to SAN. Ha! Pretty sure Southwest pays $160/hour.
ExpressJet keeps lowering the bar, right?
03-12-2008, 07:09 AM
#65
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: XJT furloughed due to non-ALPA undercutting
Posts: 376
DMEarc you have very valid points. I respect SWA for not farming out regional feed to the lowest bidder. It seems that a lot of DAL, CAL or NWA guys don't care that the FOs that fly their regional stuff are on poverty wages. I don't see them putting pressure on management to pay the regional pilots more. I sure wish they would...
Our branded isn't really a large threat to you guys, and you know it. Sure there are some duplicate routes, but we only take 50 seats at a time, not 140 on a 737. In the current market there's no way we could get 737 pay on an ERJ. You guys would toast us in every market. Pure numbers.
If XJT has the leading contract for regionals, how can we try to raise the bar when it is being lowered on the other end by Colgan? How can we ask for better pay rates if Continental is going to take our flying and contract it to CHQ or Colgan? This is the point of much frustration for XJT pilots. Perhaps management too? I bet our management wouldn't mind paying us more if they could- but they can't because we'll be underbid by another pilot group just trying to build time.
I respect SWA for paying their pilots well and running a profitable efficient operation; much more efficient than the legacies.
Our branded isn't really a large threat to you guys, and you know it. Sure there are some duplicate routes, but we only take 50 seats at a time, not 140 on a 737. In the current market there's no way we could get 737 pay on an ERJ. You guys would toast us in every market. Pure numbers.
If XJT has the leading contract for regionals, how can we try to raise the bar when it is being lowered on the other end by Colgan? How can we ask for better pay rates if Continental is going to take our flying and contract it to CHQ or Colgan? This is the point of much frustration for XJT pilots. Perhaps management too? I bet our management wouldn't mind paying us more if they could- but they can't because we'll be underbid by another pilot group just trying to build time.
I respect SWA for paying their pilots well and running a profitable efficient operation; much more efficient than the legacies.
03-12-2008, 07:33 AM
#66
Super Moderator
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 3,945
sorry guys but this thread is getting closed soley because it has nothing to do with the colgan pilot development program and more to do with who has the industry leading contract or who undercut who.
try to stay on topic
try to stay on topic
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