How Is Pinnacle Doing
07-23-2008 | 03:46 PM
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How Is Pinnacle Doing
Is Pinnacle going to make it through all of this turmoil and be pretty much left alone and solid.....How did working out terms with DL help.....How about the DL/NWA merger.....What is the state of Pinnacle.
07-23-2008 | 03:57 PM
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From: Bus driver
We are good currently, pilots are still poor and overworked though, thanks for asking! ;-)
How is your regional?
Do you have a job? If you do continue to go to that job.
Are you furloughed or looking for work? We are hiring into a pool. You need 1000/200. It is competitive- supply/demand.
How long are upgrades? Who knows, they have come to a slow crawl.
How's the contract? Nothing new as of July 23rd, 2008 at 6:52CT
Bases? MSP is hard to get since flying reductions happened mainly there, MEM and DTW are realistic. DTW is most Junior. ATL is the only "growth" spot but I would bet ya a beer with this latest bid (ATL IS THE ONLY OPENINGS) it will go senior. I bid 40something in MEM and could prob only hold FO.
Predictions? Ahh hell... copy paste here I go..
If you want me to speculate as a "shareholder" and "observer" from the pilot standpoint I will say this much.
Pinnacle holds contracts til 2017 for both the -200 and -900 flying. We are currently flying the minimum number of a/c under both contracts WITH options for aircraft on BOTH sides (which after the merger is essentially 1 big contract). Pinnacle currently holds the options for more CR9's. The service agreement with NWA allows for a 1:1 (200:900) swap so there is a way out of the "50 seat mess". There are numerous lawsuits and an arbitration that the company and union are dealing with. Performance is #2 in the nation.
Colgan has the Q400 flying WITH options for more. There is plenty of rumors on that side (that I will not get into since I do not have all the facts) but an ALPA drive and mgmt moves (dropping routes) are the big things going on over there- at least issues that have been hot to my ears.
The contract "big deal" issues are Scope (referred by "internals" as section 1) and Scheduling (Referred to as section 25) and some financials. Sec 25 was TA'd a while back (and took in the neighborhood of 2 years to close) and mgmt wants to reopen. Why? Well the only publicly released detail was released by the VP and head negotiator on the company's behalf- increase CREDIT by 10 hours per month (from 75-95 up to 85-105). This sounds like "more money" to most but has more negative than positive- QOL takes a beating, especially with vacation and/or training in a given month (no reduction in flying, "days off" become available for your vacation and training credits). Pncl is VERY efficient at getting their use out of pilots- I came quite close to timing out last year and this year I will be timing out unless I get bought off for at least a month's worth of flying. The company wants to reopen scheduling, we see it as STILL TA'd. Financials will always have a split to the very end. We (pilots) are getting rid of the 15 min trip value window (get block or better) for sure(CS even mentioned this in the latest nastygram), beyond that its very "dynamic" and I have no info that has been released publicly (I have been told a few variations of the "goal" but nothing officially). We are NOT going for an "industry leading" payrate, instead an industry average rate with the ability to make more on the w-2 via work rules, soft money, and premium pay for those who enjoy being "air wh*res".
Why do "I" think there is a push for negotiating a pilot contract:
1. Political climate
2. Delta- we do 30+% on NWA flying, 99% strike vote, new NMB will be in place shortly after the merger goes through, we are the ONLY regional without a pilot contract (other than mesa which is just trying to keep the flying), and mgmt DOES NOT WANT A COMAIR STRIKE PART 2 when they are trying to merge and grow market share under the "new global airline" banner.
3. Scope arbitration
4. Mgmt trying to sign a contract as cheap as possible (timing the dip in the economy) so they can be "very competitive" to bid on more flying on the next upswing or next chance with a major.
These are my "thoughts" off the top of my head that I have been claiming for a while now. These "thoughts" are based on facts and historic trend.
As always ask away.... I just hope this thread can stay open... If you have specific questions you don't wanna post just PM me... I am sitting in Canada bored!
How is your regional?
Do you have a job? If you do continue to go to that job.
Are you furloughed or looking for work? We are hiring into a pool. You need 1000/200. It is competitive- supply/demand.
How long are upgrades? Who knows, they have come to a slow crawl.
How's the contract? Nothing new as of July 23rd, 2008 at 6:52CT
Bases? MSP is hard to get since flying reductions happened mainly there, MEM and DTW are realistic. DTW is most Junior. ATL is the only "growth" spot but I would bet ya a beer with this latest bid (ATL IS THE ONLY OPENINGS) it will go senior. I bid 40something in MEM and could prob only hold FO.
Predictions? Ahh hell... copy paste here I go..
If you want me to speculate as a "shareholder" and "observer" from the pilot standpoint I will say this much.
Pinnacle holds contracts til 2017 for both the -200 and -900 flying. We are currently flying the minimum number of a/c under both contracts WITH options for aircraft on BOTH sides (which after the merger is essentially 1 big contract). Pinnacle currently holds the options for more CR9's. The service agreement with NWA allows for a 1:1 (200:900) swap so there is a way out of the "50 seat mess". There are numerous lawsuits and an arbitration that the company and union are dealing with. Performance is #2 in the nation.
Colgan has the Q400 flying WITH options for more. There is plenty of rumors on that side (that I will not get into since I do not have all the facts) but an ALPA drive and mgmt moves (dropping routes) are the big things going on over there- at least issues that have been hot to my ears.
The contract "big deal" issues are Scope (referred by "internals" as section 1) and Scheduling (Referred to as section 25) and some financials. Sec 25 was TA'd a while back (and took in the neighborhood of 2 years to close) and mgmt wants to reopen. Why? Well the only publicly released detail was released by the VP and head negotiator on the company's behalf- increase CREDIT by 10 hours per month (from 75-95 up to 85-105). This sounds like "more money" to most but has more negative than positive- QOL takes a beating, especially with vacation and/or training in a given month (no reduction in flying, "days off" become available for your vacation and training credits). Pncl is VERY efficient at getting their use out of pilots- I came quite close to timing out last year and this year I will be timing out unless I get bought off for at least a month's worth of flying. The company wants to reopen scheduling, we see it as STILL TA'd. Financials will always have a split to the very end. We (pilots) are getting rid of the 15 min trip value window (get block or better) for sure(CS even mentioned this in the latest nastygram), beyond that its very "dynamic" and I have no info that has been released publicly (I have been told a few variations of the "goal" but nothing officially). We are NOT going for an "industry leading" payrate, instead an industry average rate with the ability to make more on the w-2 via work rules, soft money, and premium pay for those who enjoy being "air wh*res".
Why do "I" think there is a push for negotiating a pilot contract:
1. Political climate
2. Delta- we do 30+% on NWA flying, 99% strike vote, new NMB will be in place shortly after the merger goes through, we are the ONLY regional without a pilot contract (other than mesa which is just trying to keep the flying), and mgmt DOES NOT WANT A COMAIR STRIKE PART 2 when they are trying to merge and grow market share under the "new global airline" banner.
3. Scope arbitration
4. Mgmt trying to sign a contract as cheap as possible (timing the dip in the economy) so they can be "very competitive" to bid on more flying on the next upswing or next chance with a major.
These are my "thoughts" off the top of my head that I have been claiming for a while now. These "thoughts" are based on facts and historic trend.
As always ask away.... I just hope this thread can stay open... If you have specific questions you don't wanna post just PM me... I am sitting in Canada bored!
07-23-2008 | 04:59 PM
#5
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Pretty much what higney85 posted above. Obviously there's a lot of speculation going around the merger, but that's exactly what it is, speculation. Except for ATL the company is understaffed, and that's the way mgmt is planning to run the airline. Lineholders are forced to almost 100 hrs/month, unless really senior. Still you get treated like a child, and respect to the pilot group from the company is almost non-existing overall.
Future.......humm......well in my personal opinion, (key word personal), the biggest concern right now with Colgan it's scope. From the finnacial point of view, Colgan's very poor economical performance and the innability of PNCL to "flip them" into a profitable company. (the original plan).
Also, with the merger, although we have a solid contract with NW, in the long run doesn't mean much in this business. NW is bringing two "legit" kids, (compass and Mesaba) into the family, and us, the "redheaded stepchild" (in DL's point of view). If the new DL needed more flying, I don't see why they'd give us any, they are going to own Compass and Mesaba, and they can easiely rev up both of them, there's a lot of money invested in both Compass and XJ and so far we haven't seen any intentions from NW to increase our flying or give us newer efficient airplanes. We have a bunch of 50 seaters that nobody wants, and DL has made clear that they need to get rid of them overall.
Now, before anybody starts flaiming, I'm not saying PNCL is gonna go away, but I'm really curious to see what happens. If I was to bet money, I would have to bet that nothing good is going to happen to PNCL after the merger, sorry guys.....just a feeling......I'm hopping I'm wrong. Meanwhile there's nothing I can do, so I'm not going to stress about it. I guess you can call me a negative person, but in this particular case I haven't found any reasons to expect better.
Future.......humm......well in my personal opinion, (key word personal), the biggest concern right now with Colgan it's scope. From the finnacial point of view, Colgan's very poor economical performance and the innability of PNCL to "flip them" into a profitable company. (the original plan).
Also, with the merger, although we have a solid contract with NW, in the long run doesn't mean much in this business. NW is bringing two "legit" kids, (compass and Mesaba) into the family, and us, the "redheaded stepchild" (in DL's point of view). If the new DL needed more flying, I don't see why they'd give us any, they are going to own Compass and Mesaba, and they can easiely rev up both of them, there's a lot of money invested in both Compass and XJ and so far we haven't seen any intentions from NW to increase our flying or give us newer efficient airplanes. We have a bunch of 50 seaters that nobody wants, and DL has made clear that they need to get rid of them overall.
Now, before anybody starts flaiming, I'm not saying PNCL is gonna go away, but I'm really curious to see what happens. If I was to bet money, I would have to bet that nothing good is going to happen to PNCL after the merger, sorry guys.....just a feeling......I'm hopping I'm wrong. Meanwhile there's nothing I can do, so I'm not going to stress about it. I guess you can call me a negative person, but in this particular case I haven't found any reasons to expect better.
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