Mesa TA
12-02-2008 | 10:41 PM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,001
Likes: 0
Folks have asked what I think. I'm in the 'no' camp. I've written extensively about 'why' in the Mesalouge. Most of my major points have been covered by some of the posts on this board. In short, I think the current situation is better than this new TA, and the only real gain for all of the MAG pilots is line guarantee (everything else is pandering to a specific group, most often the junior FOs on the CRJ, the best group to pander to due to their size and the ease of deceit). I think PBS is a concession, as is crew check in, and most of this TA in general (though I don't know why Mesa should be taking concessions). I think MAG needs a 2:1 duty rig, liberal trip trading rules, and a min staffing rule as a bare minimum. None of these are in this TA - hence, there's no reason to even consider working under it. I don't want to cost the company $, I want them to have an incentive to improve the QOL. If some pilots want to work on all their days off and have no QOL but line their pockets, then so be it. But for those who don't want to work 90 hours a month with 11 days off, I don't think they should have to. I don't subscribe for a moment to rules that force you to work more as a pseudonym for higher pay, which is the 'pay increase' that is being sold @ the road shows.
The below thinking will be the downfall of MAG, IMO:
Pilots like this don't even speak honestly to their own crew - they are liars, and thus worse than useless. How can you have a open conversation about the TA when the other party won't even discuss the merits of it? As long as pilots like this permeate Mesa's ranks, it's an uphill battle. The MAG pilots are being undermined by lies and deceit from their own - the cancer within.
The inference here is that anyone who's not voting 'yes' is uneducated. Even if we accept this premise, how can the 'uneducated' no voters benefit from the 'educated' yes voters if the educated won't share their knowledge, but rather horde it behind a lie? If one is truly educated about an issue, they owe it to 'the uneducated masses' to share their knowledge, rather than hide it and 'dumb themselves down' to the masses level.
I'm hopeful that the MAG pilots will be able to purge the cancer from within and redouble their efforts to securing the real goals of this negotiation as I understand them: increases in QOL while maintaining an industry standard compensation scheme that doesn't lose CPI value over time.
The below thinking will be the downfall of MAG, IMO:
I've spoke with many people who have gone to the road shows and participated in the conference calls and actually are going to make an educated decision, most of the people who fall into that category are going to vote yes.
I'm hopeful that the MAG pilots will be able to purge the cancer from within and redouble their efforts to securing the real goals of this negotiation as I understand them: increases in QOL while maintaining an industry standard compensation scheme that doesn't lose CPI value over time.
Last edited by Sniper; 12-02-2008 at 10:46 PM. Reason: added text
12-03-2008 | 10:16 AM
#52
Thread Starter
Line Holder
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 244
Likes: 1
DashRocks,
Here are my responses to you:
Okay lets look at the facts.
The following is taken from the following link and may not be current but is close enough to make my point. Airline Pilot Pay Rates
For 50 seat jets FO:
Year 1 2 3 4 5
Air Wiscon 25.00 36.00 37.00 38.00 39.00
Eagle 24.34 32.89 35.71 37.48 38.43
ASA 23.00 34.72 37.08 38.24 39.41
Comair 22.00 34.00 35.00 37.00 38.00
Compass 23.00 34.00 36.00 37.00 38.00
Express 22.59 33.62 35.72 38.09 39.23
Pinnacle 20.73 24.39 30.09 33.28 34.31
Republic 22.95 30.88 35.52 36.62
Sky West 22.00 34.89 35.97 36.71 37.84
Trans Stat 22.29 25.46 32.33 33.46 34.57
Mesa now 21.72 29.10 32.46 33.85 34.86
Mesa 2010 22.18 29.71 33.14 34.56 35.59
Please tell me how FO pay is industry standard. Your Dash pay really is well below industry standard. Also remember we don't have any pay raises tied to inflation. Many of the carriers above have block or better and have CPI pay raises included.
For 50 seat jets captain:
Year 3 4 5 6 7
Air Wiscon 62.00 64.00 66.00 68.00 70.00
Eagle 65.00 66.93 68.94 71.03 72.44
ASA 61.80 63.73 65.68 67.72 69.81
Comair 59.00 61.00 63.00 65.00 67.00
Compass 65.00 67.00 69.00 71.00 73.00
Express 63.58 65.75 67.73 69.76 71.15
Pinnacle 58.51 60.31 62.14 63.96 65.52
Republic 63.04 65.00 66.99 69.07 71.21
Sky West 59.54 61.40 63.29 65.25 67.27
Trans Stat 58.57 60.33 62.08 63.84 65.81
Mesa now 57.68 59.42 61.17 62.95 64.67
Mesa 2010 57.68 59.42 61.17 62.95 64.67
Again tell me how our captain pay is industry standard?
I was going to look at 700 and 900 pay but it got too complicated but I still make my point with the data I have.
Think how below industry standard we will be in 5 years time with no CPI link. We need the CPI link NOW to set a precidence for all future negotiations.
I'm sorry I must have missed the language in the TA that contains the penalty clauses if JA's are not reduced by at least 30%. Can you direct me to that page in the contract?
What I did read was the following:
I don't see how this puts us in the driver seat with regards to JA.
It is only an improper reasignment IF there are no ready reserves OR the flight is going to be late. This puts the company in the driving seat. They define the number of ready reserves so could easily manipulate this number to avoid paying premium pay AND we would have to prove there was no ready reserves. How do we prove that? Secondly the only reason they junior assign a pilot is if a flight is going to be late. This language means the company will never pay premium pay ever again.
I still don't know how this compares to the Harris Award because all the pertinant links on the ALPA page regarding the Harris Award seem to be broken. Can anybody explain to me what the details of the Harris Award because I'd hate for this contract to over shadow the Harris Award.
ALPA should be working for both. I'd be very surprised if PBS does not put more pilots on the street. I seems to me this displacement award has been delayed because the company are wanting to see if PBS gets introduced or not. I'll bet if PBS gets introduced the displacement will be greater than if we stay with the current contract. I have no data to back that up, just a gut feel.
Actually swaps and drops will not be any different under the new TA. Just because they are automated the same rules with respect to 'sufficient reserve' coverage still apply. If your Flica denials are anything like mine every one of them is due to 'insufficient reserve coverage'. How can this be with pilots on furlough? It is this way because the company has control of reserve coverage. Yes it will be more dynamic becuase the reserve coverage should change instantaneously BUT the company can make the number of reserves that triggers 'the insufficient reserve coverage' any number they like. We need language in the TA to control the level of reserves.
Like I've said in other posts it is very rare that I can straight drop a pairing that isn't commutable and swap it directly for a commutable pairing. I usuall have to massage parts of both pairings to my liking. Under the new contract I will only be able to do this after SAP and ONLY IF there is open time available. Who decides if the open time will be available. The company and we have no language controlling how long the open time should be available for swaps.
Dash I understand that you can't vote but I'm sure you voice your opinion about the contract to your colleagues and captains as I do. I just hope you fully understand the implications of what you say and have researched and understood the language correctly.
I really believe we can do better than this contract and not have to wait 2 years, actually more likely 4-6 years, for it.
My NO vote is already cast.
Here are my responses to you:
The following is taken from the following link and may not be current but is close enough to make my point. Airline Pilot Pay Rates
For 50 seat jets FO:
Year 1 2 3 4 5
Air Wiscon 25.00 36.00 37.00 38.00 39.00
Eagle 24.34 32.89 35.71 37.48 38.43
ASA 23.00 34.72 37.08 38.24 39.41
Comair 22.00 34.00 35.00 37.00 38.00
Compass 23.00 34.00 36.00 37.00 38.00
Express 22.59 33.62 35.72 38.09 39.23
Pinnacle 20.73 24.39 30.09 33.28 34.31
Republic 22.95 30.88 35.52 36.62
Sky West 22.00 34.89 35.97 36.71 37.84
Trans Stat 22.29 25.46 32.33 33.46 34.57
Mesa now 21.72 29.10 32.46 33.85 34.86
Mesa 2010 22.18 29.71 33.14 34.56 35.59
Please tell me how FO pay is industry standard. Your Dash pay really is well below industry standard. Also remember we don't have any pay raises tied to inflation. Many of the carriers above have block or better and have CPI pay raises included.
For 50 seat jets captain:
Year 3 4 5 6 7
Air Wiscon 62.00 64.00 66.00 68.00 70.00
Eagle 65.00 66.93 68.94 71.03 72.44
ASA 61.80 63.73 65.68 67.72 69.81
Comair 59.00 61.00 63.00 65.00 67.00
Compass 65.00 67.00 69.00 71.00 73.00
Express 63.58 65.75 67.73 69.76 71.15
Pinnacle 58.51 60.31 62.14 63.96 65.52
Republic 63.04 65.00 66.99 69.07 71.21
Sky West 59.54 61.40 63.29 65.25 67.27
Trans Stat 58.57 60.33 62.08 63.84 65.81
Mesa now 57.68 59.42 61.17 62.95 64.67
Mesa 2010 57.68 59.42 61.17 62.95 64.67
Again tell me how our captain pay is industry standard?
I was going to look at 700 and 900 pay but it got too complicated but I still make my point with the data I have.
Think how below industry standard we will be in 5 years time with no CPI link. We need the CPI link NOW to set a precidence for all future negotiations.
What I did read was the following:
Page 51 para F
1. The company may reassign a pilot during the trip pairing footprint.
a. Can only be done when there are no ready reserves available or if the flight to which the pilot is to be reassigned is in danger of failing to depart within the applicable code share parner's contractual performance parameters, such as D+0 or A+14
b. If an improper reassignment occurs, the pilot will be paid premium pay for the ressignment (200%)
Then per the TA letter of clarification:
A flight that is delayed and returns beyond the scheduled duty off time at the end of a trip will not be considered to have operated outside the originally scheduled 'footprint' and will not be subject to Premium Pay
1. The company may reassign a pilot during the trip pairing footprint.
a. Can only be done when there are no ready reserves available or if the flight to which the pilot is to be reassigned is in danger of failing to depart within the applicable code share parner's contractual performance parameters, such as D+0 or A+14
b. If an improper reassignment occurs, the pilot will be paid premium pay for the ressignment (200%)
Then per the TA letter of clarification:
A flight that is delayed and returns beyond the scheduled duty off time at the end of a trip will not be considered to have operated outside the originally scheduled 'footprint' and will not be subject to Premium Pay
It is only an improper reasignment IF there are no ready reserves OR the flight is going to be late. This puts the company in the driving seat. They define the number of ready reserves so could easily manipulate this number to avoid paying premium pay AND we would have to prove there was no ready reserves. How do we prove that? Secondly the only reason they junior assign a pilot is if a flight is going to be late. This language means the company will never pay premium pay ever again.
I still don't know how this compares to the Harris Award because all the pertinant links on the ALPA page regarding the Harris Award seem to be broken. Can anybody explain to me what the details of the Harris Award because I'd hate for this contract to over shadow the Harris Award.
Like I've said in other posts it is very rare that I can straight drop a pairing that isn't commutable and swap it directly for a commutable pairing. I usuall have to massage parts of both pairings to my liking. Under the new contract I will only be able to do this after SAP and ONLY IF there is open time available. Who decides if the open time will be available. The company and we have no language controlling how long the open time should be available for swaps.
Dash I understand that you can't vote but I'm sure you voice your opinion about the contract to your colleagues and captains as I do. I just hope you fully understand the implications of what you say and have researched and understood the language correctly.
I really believe we can do better than this contract and not have to wait 2 years, actually more likely 4-6 years, for it.
My NO vote is already cast.
12-03-2008 | 10:42 AM
#53
*********
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,068
Likes: 0
Pbs
DENDash-
Ask any pilot (with the exception of MAG pilots) what PBS does for a pilot group. It makes them more efficient, eliminates open time, and thus reduces the number of pilots needed to fly the same amount of block hours.
Read between the lines: its a concession. While it does offer the senior guys an increase in QOL, it won't do anything for you. I know this b/c the DEN D-8 is junior. I'm roughly halfway up the list, and I doubt I'll see any increase in the QOL. Maybe a day or two a month.
As I mentioned in a different thread, the current lines will result in a better QOL for junior guys, compared to PBS. With the current lines, the crap is spread a little more evenly across the pilots of a given domecile. Ex/ This month. There are only so many lines that have X-MAS eve and day off. The rest work some portion of one or both. Some of those lines with both off, work every weekend and new years. Some of the senior guys are willing to "throw" the whole bid away for 2 days out of 28. Others aren't. So, some junior lineholders are afforded the opportunity to have x-mas off.
With PBS, the senior guys will bid x-mas eve and day, weekends and new years off. Some/Most will get it. The next wave of guys (Group B) will bid mostly the same thing. Some of group B will get x-mas, new years, and a weekend. The middle of the road guys will get weekends and maybe new years, and the junior guys will get none of it. Meaning, all holidays and weekend flying.
Being junior entitles you to nothing, but by the same token, shouldn't lock you in to the worst days, trips, and overall schedule. I'm not exactly junior, but this aspect of PBS concerns me for those who are.
Ask any pilot (with the exception of MAG pilots) what PBS does for a pilot group. It makes them more efficient, eliminates open time, and thus reduces the number of pilots needed to fly the same amount of block hours.
Read between the lines: its a concession. While it does offer the senior guys an increase in QOL, it won't do anything for you. I know this b/c the DEN D-8 is junior. I'm roughly halfway up the list, and I doubt I'll see any increase in the QOL. Maybe a day or two a month.
As I mentioned in a different thread, the current lines will result in a better QOL for junior guys, compared to PBS. With the current lines, the crap is spread a little more evenly across the pilots of a given domecile. Ex/ This month. There are only so many lines that have X-MAS eve and day off. The rest work some portion of one or both. Some of those lines with both off, work every weekend and new years. Some of the senior guys are willing to "throw" the whole bid away for 2 days out of 28. Others aren't. So, some junior lineholders are afforded the opportunity to have x-mas off.
With PBS, the senior guys will bid x-mas eve and day, weekends and new years off. Some/Most will get it. The next wave of guys (Group B) will bid mostly the same thing. Some of group B will get x-mas, new years, and a weekend. The middle of the road guys will get weekends and maybe new years, and the junior guys will get none of it. Meaning, all holidays and weekend flying.
Being junior entitles you to nothing, but by the same token, shouldn't lock you in to the worst days, trips, and overall schedule. I'm not exactly junior, but this aspect of PBS concerns me for those who are.
Last edited by paxhauler85; 12-03-2008 at 07:25 PM.
12-03-2008 | 12:28 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 467
Likes: 0
MESA Airline Pilots,
This TA is a Trojan Horse!
VOTE NO!
Winglet
--------------------------------------------------
"The greater danger for most of us lies not in setting our aim too high and falling short; but in setting our aim too low, and achieving our mark.”
Michelangelo
This TA is a Trojan Horse!
VOTE NO!
Winglet
--------------------------------------------------
"The greater danger for most of us lies not in setting our aim too high and falling short; but in setting our aim too low, and achieving our mark.”
Michelangelo
12-03-2008 | 03:15 PM
#56
Banned
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,350
Likes: 0
Folks have asked what I think. I'm in the 'no' camp. I've written extensively about 'why' in the Mesalouge. Most of my major points have been covered by some of the posts on this board. In short, I think the current situation is better than this new TA, and the only real gain for all of the MAG pilots is line guarantee (everything else is pandering to a specific group, most often the junior FOs on the CRJ, the best group to pander to due to their size and the ease of deceit). I think PBS is a concession, as is crew check in, and most of this TA in general (though I don't know why Mesa should be taking concessions). I think MAG needs a 2:1 duty rig, liberal trip trading rules, and a min staffing rule as a bare minimum. None of these are in this TA - hence, there's no reason to even consider working under it. I don't want to cost the company $, I want them to have an incentive to improve the QOL. If some pilots want to work on all their days off and have no QOL but line their pockets, then so be it. But for those who don't want to work 90 hours a month with 11 days off, I don't think they should have to. I don't subscribe for a moment to rules that force you to work more as a pseudonym for higher pay, which is the 'pay increase' that is being sold @ the road shows.
The below thinking will be the downfall of MAG, IMO:
Pilots like this don't even speak honestly to their own crew - they are liars, and thus worse than useless. How can you have a open conversation about the TA when the other party won't even discuss the merits of it? As long as pilots like this permeate Mesa's ranks, it's an uphill battle. The MAG pilots are being undermined by lies and deceit from their own - the cancer within.
The inference here is that anyone who's not voting 'yes' is uneducated. Even if we accept this premise, how can the 'uneducated' no voters benefit from the 'educated' yes voters if the educated won't share their knowledge, but rather horde it behind a lie? If one is truly educated about an issue, they owe it to 'the uneducated masses' to share their knowledge, rather than hide it and 'dumb themselves down' to the masses level.
I'm hopeful that the MAG pilots will be able to purge the cancer from within and redouble their efforts to securing the real goals of this negotiation as I understand them: increases in QOL while maintaining an industry standard compensation scheme that doesn't lose CPI value over time.
The below thinking will be the downfall of MAG, IMO:
Pilots like this don't even speak honestly to their own crew - they are liars, and thus worse than useless. How can you have a open conversation about the TA when the other party won't even discuss the merits of it? As long as pilots like this permeate Mesa's ranks, it's an uphill battle. The MAG pilots are being undermined by lies and deceit from their own - the cancer within.
The inference here is that anyone who's not voting 'yes' is uneducated. Even if we accept this premise, how can the 'uneducated' no voters benefit from the 'educated' yes voters if the educated won't share their knowledge, but rather horde it behind a lie? If one is truly educated about an issue, they owe it to 'the uneducated masses' to share their knowledge, rather than hide it and 'dumb themselves down' to the masses level.
I'm hopeful that the MAG pilots will be able to purge the cancer from within and redouble their efforts to securing the real goals of this negotiation as I understand them: increases in QOL while maintaining an industry standard compensation scheme that doesn't lose CPI value over time.
Mesa Management WANTS you to ratify this horrifying "agreement". They HOPE you succumb to fear. They PREY you are saps and cannot see the forest thru the trees.
So far, their philosophy has worked. Why not stay with what has worked. It's time to say enough is enough. The bottom line is :
YOU WILL NOT GET ANOTHER CHANCE TO "RAISE" MESA COMPENSATION AND TREATMENT TO EVEN REGIONAL AVERAGE LEVELS.
Don't fall for this con again.....................good luck and godspeed.
12-03-2008 | 06:50 PM
#57
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 437
Likes: 0
From: NU Guy
WARNING : The above is Mesa management philosophy. "Sniper" is exactly that......someone hiding in the bushes attempting to pick you off.
Mesa Management WANTS you to ratify this horrifying "agreement". They HOPE you succumb to fear. They PREY you are saps and cannot see the forest thru the trees.
So far, their philosophy has worked. Why not stay with what has worked. It's time to say enough is enough. The bottom line is :
YOU WILL NOT GET ANOTHER CHANCE TO "RAISE" MESA COMPENSATION AND TREATMENT TO EVEN REGIONAL AVERAGE LEVELS.
Don't fall for this con again.....................good luck and godspeed.
Mesa Management WANTS you to ratify this horrifying "agreement". They HOPE you succumb to fear. They PREY you are saps and cannot see the forest thru the trees.
So far, their philosophy has worked. Why not stay with what has worked. It's time to say enough is enough. The bottom line is :
YOU WILL NOT GET ANOTHER CHANCE TO "RAISE" MESA COMPENSATION AND TREATMENT TO EVEN REGIONAL AVERAGE LEVELS.
Don't fall for this con again.....................good luck and godspeed.
Did you somehow miss his opening sentence? Here it is again in-case you missed it.
Originally Posted by sniper
Folks have asked what I think. I'm in the 'no' camp. I've written extensively about 'why' in the Mesalouge.
12-04-2008 | 07:28 AM
#58
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 305
Likes: 0
From: DHC-8 CA Furloughed
DashRocks,
Here are my responses to you:
For 50 seat jets FO:
Please tell me how FO pay is industry standard.
Mesa FO pay is higher than two of the companies on your list. Not at the bottom, but too close to the bottom.
Your Dash pay really is well below industry standard.
That's ******* right! There should not be as big a gap between jet and Dash pay. I wish the TA addressed this, yet I would still vote yes because I do not think I can get everything I want.
Many of the carriers above have block or better and have CPI pay raises included.
Mesa will have block or better under the TA.
Again tell me how our captain pay is industry standard?
At the high end of the longevity scale, Mesa's rates exceed some other carrier's. Mesa pay tends to the low side of the industry, but will not be rock bottom with the change to block or better.
Think how below industry standard we will be in 5 years time with no CPI link. We need the CPI link NOW to set a precidence for all future negotiations.
Yep, that would be a good strategy. I would love to have a tie to CPI. I do not think it is realistic to expect that of this company in this ecomomy. The TA only lasts 2 years, not 5.
Regarding pay; Mesa has fewer pilots on furlough than many of the other carriers in your lists. I would rather be flying for $3.00/hour less than be furloughed from a company that used to pay me $3.00/hour more.
...I must have missed the language in the TA that contains the penalty clauses if JA's are not reduced by at least 30%.
I misspoke. The letter our MEC put out states that the company must reopen bargaining on reducing JA's within 15 months if JA's are not reduced by at least 30%.
I don't see how this puts us in the driver seat with regards to JA.
I think we would be in the driver's seat because the ALPA folks explained during a TELCON that JA's go to the "junior available" pilot and that it is up to the pilot him/herself to determine if he/she is available.
It is only an improper reasignment IF there are no ready reserves OR the flight is going to be late.
H. Premium Pay
1. Junior Available and improper reassignment segments will be paid at 200% of rate for equipment flown.
I take this to mean that if the company reassigns you in violation of the TA, you get 200%. JA means the assignment uses time you were supposed to be off work.
This puts the company in the driving seat. They define the number of ready reserves so could easily manipulate this number to avoid paying premium pay AND we would have to prove there was no ready reserves. How do we prove that? Secondly the only reason they junior assign a pilot is if a flight is going to be late. This language means the company will never pay premium pay ever again.
My understanding; During the footprint of your trip/pairing, the company can reassign you. This cannot impinge on time off. If it does, you get 200%. If you lose time off, extra dough.
I'll bet if PBS gets introduced the displacement will be greater than if we stay with the current contract. I have no data to back that up, just a gut feel.
My Brother, most of us are factoring "gut feel" into our decision at some point. My gut says, this TA is pretty good for the current state of the industry.
Dash I understand that you can't vote but I'm sure you voice your opinion about the contract to your colleagues and captains as I do. I just hope you fully understand the implications of what you say and have researched and understood the language correctly.
I try to be as informed as I can. I also value and respect the differing opinions of others. Yesterday, my FO expressed the hope that the TA is defeated. "I should probably be careful what I say, I might be angering you", he said. I told him that it is a vital and complex issue, that everyone has their own hopes and needs they factor into the decision.
My NO vote is already cast.
Here are my responses to you:
For 50 seat jets FO:
Please tell me how FO pay is industry standard.
Mesa FO pay is higher than two of the companies on your list. Not at the bottom, but too close to the bottom.
Your Dash pay really is well below industry standard.
That's ******* right! There should not be as big a gap between jet and Dash pay. I wish the TA addressed this, yet I would still vote yes because I do not think I can get everything I want.
Many of the carriers above have block or better and have CPI pay raises included.
Mesa will have block or better under the TA.
Again tell me how our captain pay is industry standard?
At the high end of the longevity scale, Mesa's rates exceed some other carrier's. Mesa pay tends to the low side of the industry, but will not be rock bottom with the change to block or better.
Think how below industry standard we will be in 5 years time with no CPI link. We need the CPI link NOW to set a precidence for all future negotiations.
Yep, that would be a good strategy. I would love to have a tie to CPI. I do not think it is realistic to expect that of this company in this ecomomy. The TA only lasts 2 years, not 5.
Regarding pay; Mesa has fewer pilots on furlough than many of the other carriers in your lists. I would rather be flying for $3.00/hour less than be furloughed from a company that used to pay me $3.00/hour more.
...I must have missed the language in the TA that contains the penalty clauses if JA's are not reduced by at least 30%.
I misspoke. The letter our MEC put out states that the company must reopen bargaining on reducing JA's within 15 months if JA's are not reduced by at least 30%.
I don't see how this puts us in the driver seat with regards to JA.
I think we would be in the driver's seat because the ALPA folks explained during a TELCON that JA's go to the "junior available" pilot and that it is up to the pilot him/herself to determine if he/she is available.
It is only an improper reasignment IF there are no ready reserves OR the flight is going to be late.
H. Premium Pay
1. Junior Available and improper reassignment segments will be paid at 200% of rate for equipment flown.
I take this to mean that if the company reassigns you in violation of the TA, you get 200%. JA means the assignment uses time you were supposed to be off work.
This puts the company in the driving seat. They define the number of ready reserves so could easily manipulate this number to avoid paying premium pay AND we would have to prove there was no ready reserves. How do we prove that? Secondly the only reason they junior assign a pilot is if a flight is going to be late. This language means the company will never pay premium pay ever again.
My understanding; During the footprint of your trip/pairing, the company can reassign you. This cannot impinge on time off. If it does, you get 200%. If you lose time off, extra dough.
I'll bet if PBS gets introduced the displacement will be greater than if we stay with the current contract. I have no data to back that up, just a gut feel.
My Brother, most of us are factoring "gut feel" into our decision at some point. My gut says, this TA is pretty good for the current state of the industry.
Dash I understand that you can't vote but I'm sure you voice your opinion about the contract to your colleagues and captains as I do. I just hope you fully understand the implications of what you say and have researched and understood the language correctly.
I try to be as informed as I can. I also value and respect the differing opinions of others. Yesterday, my FO expressed the hope that the TA is defeated. "I should probably be careful what I say, I might be angering you", he said. I told him that it is a vital and complex issue, that everyone has their own hopes and needs they factor into the decision.
My NO vote is already cast.
The Dash Whisperer
Last edited by TheDashRocks; 12-04-2008 at 08:31 AM. Reason: seplling
12-04-2008 | 08:51 AM
#59
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 45,127
Likes: 796
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
WARNING : The above is Mesa management philosophy. "Sniper" is exactly that......someone hiding in the bushes attempting to pick you off.
Mesa Management WANTS you to ratify this horrifying "agreement". They HOPE you succumb to fear. They PREY you are saps and cannot see the forest thru the trees.
So far, their philosophy has worked. Why not stay with what has worked. It's time to say enough is enough. The bottom line is :
YOU WILL NOT GET ANOTHER CHANCE TO "RAISE" MESA COMPENSATION AND TREATMENT TO EVEN REGIONAL AVERAGE LEVELS.
Don't fall for this con again.....................good luck and godspeed.
Mesa Management WANTS you to ratify this horrifying "agreement". They HOPE you succumb to fear. They PREY you are saps and cannot see the forest thru the trees.
So far, their philosophy has worked. Why not stay with what has worked. It's time to say enough is enough. The bottom line is :
YOU WILL NOT GET ANOTHER CHANCE TO "RAISE" MESA COMPENSATION AND TREATMENT TO EVEN REGIONAL AVERAGE LEVELS.
Don't fall for this con again.....................good luck and godspeed.
Sniper has been around a long time, and has a lot of insight on MAG (I doubt he still works there, guys as smart as him have mostly found a way out). He has always been in the anti-JO camp for sure.
12-04-2008 | 09:05 AM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 366
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From: Stage Left
Ladies and Gentlemen at MAG,
Never, EVER, EVER look at the late years of contract as an attraction. They have always, and will always, be fluff for your consideration yet never intended to be fulfilled by anywhere close to 50% +1 of you.
JO will try for:
a) Bankruptcy
b) Concessionary Terms
c) J4J Terms on a new LOA
d) All of the above
....before you'll see the duration of this contract fulfilled.
We've all seen this time and time and time again.
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