Thats a great answer for the school house. There is school house logic and line logic. There certainly are things that can be overlooked. This sounds bad, but in reality, its the way it is. The system is not perfect but sometimes it is our job to complete the mission. Obviously this is a controversial statement, but its just how it works.

I will say I am very skeptical of post #22. I have searched all over ALPA, AEPA, and Googled several excerpts from post #22 and the only thing that comes up is this airlinepilotforums.com post#22. If this information was out yet I think it would be posted and available elsewhere. Plus I am on the ALPA email list and the ALPA emails I received up to today has nothing about furlough.

Not to say furlough isn't imminent, I just dont see any proof to back up AmericanEagleFO's post.

It is not an official notice of any kind. Look who the letter is addressed to - "Fellow DFW Pilots,". It is simply a heads up email from LEC 83 (DFW) reps that the company is tossing around the "F" word. Call your local union rep to see if they can give any insight. Otherwise, wait for big announcement tomorrow!...or next Friday ;)

OK so lets say a window shade is busted. You don't write it up to "complete the mission". You get back to DFW and a passenger comes up to you and informs you he is an FAA safety inspector doing an audit and asks to check the maintenance log. He notices the busted window shade and lack of a write up. Both members of the crew are now SOL. Don't think it can happen to you, think again. It happened to a ORD EMJ crew about a year ago. There is also an F4 message about it now. I know many of the ATR captains in DFW and they are all a bunch of great guys and gal. They all also want to eventually move on to other places. Taking off with a known deficiency no matter how insignificant could hurt their future.

Next time some FA or FO tells me about a window shade being busted, me as the PIC, will write it up and ground the airplane for it regardless if its in an outstation or a hub. Dont care if its the go home leg or not.
Play with fire and you will get burned.

First off, it was an "EGL 83 Message from Val Jester 3-26-09" email.
Secondly, what did you think I did, write the letter myself just to get a rise out of you guys? Please don't call me a liar sir, for I am not.

The answer to that scenario is "it broke on landing".

Or - "I hit it with my Jepps about 30 seconds ago".

How could they prove it was broken previous to that?

If we were to write up every specific little stupid thing then the planes would never fly. No airline would go anywhere. Ontime performance wouldn't exist. There are things you have to chose to ignore. Pick your battles wisely because you can't fight them all.

I am vouching for AmericanEagleFO - I received the same email from EGL 83. It is not a fabrication. It was not sent out company wide and was sent personally to 83 people.

Which, of course, makes sense. Clearly news like that does not affect everybody.

Or, you could follow the company policy to the letter like you are being paid to do. Your "assumption" that the planes woudl never go anywhere speaks volumes about your time at 121 airlines. Just because you, and those around you are a bunch of cowboys, don't lump the rest of the profession into that group. There are many who take their job seriously, and do not play managements wink and nod game... those are the ones you should learn from.

I have NEVER heard of a pilot anywhere getting in trouble for writing something up that was broken... while the record books and accident files are full of examples of those who didn't.

You need to finish the sentence....

....it is our job to complete the mission, in accordance with company policy and FAA regulation in the safest manner possible.

I submitt that what you and others are describing, is not the mark of a professional airline pilot.

How may times does your company, the management, the mx dept, the flight dept, the training dept and every other dept... along with the FAA, the NTSB, the media, and even the pilots association have to tell you to write things up, before it will sink into your head.

Yes, your job is to go from point A to point B, but not with a broken airplane it isn't.

I think viewing commercial flights as "missions" is the root of the problem. This is some carry-over from military flying that should have been left there. The job, not mission, is to operate the way the above post just described. Too many times have I seen "the mission must be accomplished" attitude cause more cancellations, delays, and loss of our pay than if we had just operated the way we are employed to. An airline can, in fact, operate more profitably and safer without this mindset.

And here's an example not associated with mx write-ups. -- Hey I know. The next time I have the cold/flu I'm going to go to work anyway because the mission must be accomplished. Nevermind the fact I'm going to spread it to everyone else causing a chain-reaction and I won't be able to give 100% during an emergency. We're paid peanuts to go above and beyond, mindless as the our logic may be!

:)

March 27, 2009



To All American Eagle Pilots,

By now you have probably read today’s Special Eaglewire from Peter Bowler, that addresses our current over-staffing and the necessary furlough of 75 American Eagle pilots – as well as the reduction of 45 management positions. A copy of this letter can be found on Jetnet.

These actions are truly regrettable, but – given the serious economic crisis we are facing and our current level of spending that exceeds our 2009 budget – we simply must reduce staffing levels in line with our reduced level of flying.

Those of you who are being furloughed have been an important part of American Eagle’s Flight Department. You have successfully completed the finest regional airline training program in the world, piloted a fleet of modern regional aircraft and transported thousands of passengers safely
to their destinations – and we thank you for that. It is unfortunate that we have to make these decisions, and hope to be able to welcome you back when the economy and our business recover.

We plan to furlough our first group of 35 pilots on May 1, followed by an additional 40 on June 1. We will have more details to share next week, including any subsequent displacements and vacancies.

What we ask each of you is to stay focused on the task at hand and continue to fly safe. Feel free to contact either of us or your Chief Pilot with any comments or questions.

Sincerely,



David Campbell
Senior Vice-President of Technical Operations

Captain Jim Winkley
Vice President of Flight Operations

We'll there it is...

I get real aggravated with some of the rumors that float around. I've been around airlines for a very long time and it has always never seemed to fail to have rumors floating and I just thought this was another one. I know there are a small few out there that enjoy seeing how far their rumor can go and some are very creative. Sorry AmericanEagleFO

No worries bgmann. Looks like this is going back to the 4/14/08 hires. Kfour, good luck buddy. Our prayers go out to all our furloughed friends.

hmmm....i wonder if this has any connection to the fact that Eagle will have all their TSA connection planes back

Isn't Chautauqua doing some flying? How can they furlough with them doing our flying?

the Connection contracts with AA have nothing to do with Eagle. The TSA planes owned by AMR did but that issue has been resolved. The connection flying is what is left over from TWExpress. As of all the current contracts, none of it is "our" flying, its theirs.

My two cents says that this is mgmt's solution to the displacement issues. They have about the right amount of pilots but they still can't figure out where they want them and its getting too costly to keep retraining the bottom of the list until they figure out whats going on. It really sucks for the bottom 75 but I do honestly believe that this is a temporary situation until the dust from the schedule shuffles settles. Good luck to everyone involved in this mess.

I think that if Eagle made prop pay the same as jet they wouldnt have a problem at all staffing the ATR! Prop's are harder to fly than a highly automated, heated wing, jet like the EMB.

I dont get it. Raise the pay rate AE

Agreed, if they did that I would do that in a heartbeat. Honestly though I would fly anything as long as I had a job at the end of the day. Good luck to everyone.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

This is AMR where nothing makes sense.

whoooaaa......

I know a lot of people will respond with "be lucky to have a job". I am.

But I am thinking it would cost less, or the same, in the end with all the training they're going to have to do now with furlouging 75. If they want to staff the ATR, make it so there is no incentive to go to jet. All FO aircraft the same pay. Anyways...just venting.

Yeah, I never understood that pay difference either.

Well I am hoping to see a lot of open time for FOs from here on out. And there's no reason to save sick time either.

So your going to willingly pick up OT with people on the street? :mad::mad::mad:
or are you talking about Flying for RSV guys?

No....I'm hoping to see flying stay in open time and not get picked up by FOs who put a few dollars above the welfare of coworkers

just making sure

Is there any light at the end of the tunnel?

not at the airlines, just blackness and fields of wheat.

Yes. but its an on coming freight train.

There was a light at the end of the tunnel, but it burned out. Now, someone needs to crawl their butt down the long dark tunnel, and FIX IT!

You'll have to call MTX for that. And it will have to be replaced with an FAA certified bulb.

Furloughs by status
 

Here are the numbers by bid status FYI:

JFE - 25
NFE - 15
OFE - 10
OFC - 10
DFA - 4
SFA - 5
MFA - 6

I went by the next effective status as of May 1 or later if that pilot was scheduled to be in training after the effective date of the furloughs. Best of luck to all my Eagle brothers. I will pass along any job openings I hear of. Hope to have everyone back soon!

Okay, it's been a long day of flying but I'm not sure there are enough numbers there.

My mistake, misread my notes for OFC. Thanks.

I am! I need to pick up a day trip. I need to get my 100hrs within 120 days or I go back for another ride in the training house..

There are times that it is ok to pick up OT right now. Like your example, or when your baby is crying and needs food, shelter. I'm not gonna pick it up just so I can buy a wii or something like that, but I will to make ends meet. Me being evicted doesn't help that guy on the street any.

I hope that all of you will persuade your fellow pilots to send a message of unity to management by not picking up flying. Even if you are not in the bottom 75 the message will at least cause them to hesitate when considering the next round of furloughs. You will be actually helping yourself by increasing job security if you want to think of it that way. I have decided not to pick up a single flight from here on out (and yes I am poor too).

Also has anyone received a furlough notice yet? Until the first round of furloughs gets the letters it may be possible to mitigate the total number if there is an immediate and strong show of support. This furlough plan is just the latest of a long line of missteps by management starting with parking the saabs. Make them own up to it.

It's a bit late for the April OT window considering it was about half over when the announcement was made and most people probably had OT requests in already. As of May 1 though, no more OT for me. It's gonna hurt but that just means all of us have to get more creative with the way we bid. Use the contract to your advantage.