OldManReverend

This thread is just me thinking out loud, but here are some ideas I've been thinkin about and wanted to get you guys' "Constructive opinions".

Pilot Fatigue has been one of the topics in the crash of Colgan 3407, and the other thread stating 3407 could happen again, with sleeping in the crew lounge kinda sparked me to write my thoughts out.

My brother is General Contractor, and ever since 3407, he's been a little intrigued with how crappy his little brother's QOL is. (me ) So we've been talking about different ideas such as a low cost crew hotel within the airport. Hear me out.

IDEA #1---
I've stayed at some places on an army base overseas. hundreds of bunk beds in a big open room, with scattered red lights so you can see but not bright enough to keep you from sleeping. with lockers in between bunks. community showers/ washrooms down the hall. Just a place to sleep, and thats all, dayshift, nightshift... it didnt matter it was always quiet and dark in there... seemed to work great for the military.

IDEA #2---
Actual hotel style rooms, personal bathroom, but no mini-fridge. My brother argues that civillian america won't buy the barrack-style type of housing. still not sure about whether bedding should be supplied or if it should be BYOB =). anyways. it caters to those with needs for privacy.

Pros-
-eliminates ride to hotel/crashpad
-better than a couch in the crewroom
-hopefully it's realistically cheaper than a hotel/crashpad
-on airport premises.

Cons-
-Really Possible?
-theft
-cannot be permanent address
-male F/A's

Questions...
1.) How much would you realistically be willing to spend per night for either place?
2.) How could we make this secure for pilots/crew only. ie. memberships,

Please only constructive responses please. I understand it's not going to happen tomorrow, but just lookin to get your thoughts.

Feel free to add some of your own ideas.




Copy and Paste this to answer***************************




I prefer idea #___, because ___________


some additional pros...
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some additional cons...
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Answers
1.)
2.)

Flyby1206

I prefer idea #__1_, because __If I need to stay overnight because I missed the last flight home or whatever, it is probably really late at night and I plan on catching the first flight out in the morning, so I dont want to spent big bucks on a sleeping arrangement for 5-6hrs. A place for a bed where I can get some decent sleep and a hot shower would be great.

some additional pros...

Ive thought of this before, it would be amazing if someone could build housing/rooms for pilots literally at the airport.

maybe a few nicer accomodations for pilots who would need a more regular place to crash (think reserve pilots) they could even pitch in to help keep things running while they are on call (stock the vending machines, etc) for a reduced rate

if you could get this to work for a reasonable price you would basically shut down all the crashpads in the city!

some additional cons...

who will pay to build this setup?
how will you get approval (although if they can build airport hotels why not airport crashpads)
Return on investment? It will take a helllll of a long time charging low prices to get any return on the investment. Also what do you do when business is slow? Can you afford to only have this for flight crew?


Answers
1.) Depends on the city- in NYC the cheap hotels run close to $200, ORD $50, DFW $40. Keep the prices below the cheap hotels for the respective city

2.) I think this is the main thing. I dont want the general public being in this establishment. Pilots only. Maybe require a valid 121 airline ID when checking in?

Flatspin

What kind of grown man would stay in barrack style housing for $30k/yr?? I think most would just find different work and not deal with it.

I think they already make things called hotels.

flynwmn

I think they are the enlisted personnel in the military

Av8rking

Unfortunately, at airports such as JFK, the cheapest hotel option, even at a crew rate, is still about $100 per night. OldManReverend, I think you're idea is great.

rickair7777

The only time I sleep at the airport is if I get in really late and don't want to waste time getting my car and driving to the crashpad, since I'm going to take the butt-crack-of-dawn flight home anyway.

I would be OK with airport lodging for that purpose, or the late commute in with an early show. But I do NOT want to see what are essentially homeless shelters for underpaid regional FO's...set up something like this and you would have reserve pilots actually living at the airport. Think of the dynamic...you walk in the crew room to get your gear, and pick up a bad vibe. The people who actually live there don't want you lingering in THEIR living room. Get your bag, your release, and get the heck out...you don't belong.


An arrangement like that would enable the dignity and self-respect challenged types to work for even less than they do now. How 'bout we pressure regionals to pay people more instead?

Semaphore Sam

I really do NOT understand why, with the conditions offered by Regionals, crewmembers don't take advantage of overseas possibilities. Can they really be worse than what's now on offer in the States? 3 times salaries on offer here, tax-free (both local and US), housing-schooling for kids provided, no commute, better days-off, good travel benefits...why fight these battles with management, when much better terms are on offer elseware? For a "future", which we all know doesn't exist? Answers, please!

wizepilot

Even though conditions and pay really suck at the regionals, don't you think most of us would like to remain in the good ole U.S.A.? My opinion of course.

Lowlevel

The same guys that will sleep on the Pleather couch in the crew lounge with 30 other guys trying to find a chair to sleep on.

I was staying in the CL one night, after getting in too late to catch a flight home. I was tired and miserable, and was looking around the room. I thought to myself "Look at these guys, both captains and FO's, people in their 30's, 40's and 50's, sleeping on couches like we are in college or something. What a stupid job we have! Boy, are we some stupid people for doing this!?"

crustacean

I prefer hidden idea #3, because #1 and #2 are completely asinine.

Listen, when you signed up for this job, nothing was hidden from you. This wasn't some sort of mystery game where you were strung along and things were told to you piece by piece, bit by bit. You knew exactly what you were getting into, probably long before you even showed up for an interview. I honestly fail to see why the burden of your bad decision making should be placed on someone else's shoulders.

The airline you're working for told you up front how much you'd be making per hour (and, like I said, you probably did research before you went to the interview). They told you their monthly guarantee, training contract, per diem, etc. If you couldn't afford to live off of that, you should not have taken the job. It's as simple as that.

If your financial situation is so backwards that you have to sleep on a filthy drooled on couch in a crew room, wear unwashed wrinkled clothes, and eat out of a lunch pail for X number of days because the per diem you're making needs to go to something other than food, then it's time to reevaluate your life.

I mean, seriously, what's wrong with some of you? You managed to learn multiple aircraft systems, pass multiple checkrides, written exams, etc and yet some of you run around acting like you don't have the brains you were born with.

Wake up, people. Wake the hell up.

(P.S., I'm in no way endorsing the pathetic and disgusting state of the industry.)