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I'm not sure if I missed this in the authors piece, but does he count for how many of those commercial students were foreign? From personal experience, trying to find Americans wanting to take up the piloting profession is is like looking for a needle in a haystack in my part of town. There are at least 3 puppy mills cramming 300 Chinese students through the grinder every 6 months here in Dallas. That's 1500 new commercial certificates alone. My questions is, when it hits the fan again, will the airlines start looking abroad to hire foreign students at an even lower salary than they're willing to pay US citizens?
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I ran total numbers and came up with the following: Total pilots in the FAA database with a certificate (Student, Recreational, Sport, Private, Commercial, or ATP), using the USA as a "country" (the database does include foreign pilots with an FAA certificate and I did remove them from the pool), and disregarding medical expiration date I returned 526,506 certificates. When I selected just ATPs in the USA without regard to medical I returned 111,746. CMEL with an instrument rating (no ATP) without regard to medical, I returned 72,513. The combined of the two is 184,259.
You can search with a limitation on the medical expiration. I choose limit the pool to those with medicals initially issued as first class that expired or will expire in 2009 and 2010. The number of ATPs is 76,257. The number of CMELs with an instrument rating but no ATP is 18,054. The total of the two is 94,311. That number at the end of 2007 based on my search with the same methodology then was approximately 104,000. If you add in the pilots that meet the above with a medical that expired in 2008 you would add 9906. Here is a link to the FAA database through Landings.com which has a fairly good search engine: Landings: Aviation's Databases I used APC data for the current number of employed pilots. It didn't take that long to add them up. While the actual numbers are interesting and debatable, using the same methodology in Jan 2008 and now I come up with about the same number of "available" pilots in the pool. |
Originally Posted by dojetdriver
(Post 681540)
Are you talking where the FO is never required to act as IRO/RFO?
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Originally Posted by CANAM
(Post 681478)
I take it that you're single and/or on a really really long overnight somewhere.
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Originally Posted by WEACLRS
(Post 681661)
Because of ICAO rules, CAL requires all FO's/IRO's to hold a current first class medical.
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Thanks WEACLRS, interesting info.
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Originally Posted by Stratapilot
There are at least 3 puppy mills cramming 300 Chinese students through the grinder every 6 months here in Dallas.
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Originally Posted by BoilerUP
(Post 681715)
But aren't those students destined for China's own exploding aviation industry, trained in the US because (among other reasons) China simply doesn't have the required GA infrastructure to handle that volume?
WEACLERS, you are ruining the day for the typical pessimistic airline pilot. :) |
Originally Posted by Mason32
(Post 681466)
That is factually incorrect. The airlines require potential new hires to have a first class medical when being hired.... for exactly the reason you cite - to ensure they CAN get one. Once hired, and since the majority of the time the airline pays for the medical ceritificate, they do not require FO's to keep a first class medical. So, when their initial first class expires and reverts to 2nd class they continue to work. When that expires, they go get a new 2nd class medical since it is all that is required, and is cheaper.
Yes, they do have to have one to get hired, but not to remain employed. So, after their first reverts to second, then expires... the new issue will be a 2nd class and they don't appear in your study. Also, you need to clarify what you are talking about when you say major airlines, and when you say regional airlines. There are MANY airlines operating regional type equipment that the Federal Govt lists as being Major airlines... Likewise there are large aircraft operators who are not even 1/10th the size of what some people call regionals. BTW, when your 1st class medical hits 6 months it is STILL a 1st class medical. It does NOT become a 2nd class medical, you are just not allowed to excercise the privileges of that 1st class medical past 6 months. |
Originally Posted by tomgoodman
(Post 681538)
FWIW, Delta used to require F/Os and S/Os to get a first-class once a year, even though it was OK to let it "lapse" into a second-class after six months. (Don't know if this is still the policy.) The reason they gave was that it enabled them to obtain "certain waivers", perhaps having to do with insurance.
Also FWIW, a senior FAA flight surgeon advised that it's a good precaution to keep your first-class current, even if you only need a second-class now but will need a first-class down the road. He said that if some medical issue were to make granting a first-class a close call, they are more likely to renew an existing first-class than to "upgrade" a second to a first. If true, the reason for this may be more bureaucratic than medical. It still works this way at DAL. I'm a Diesel 9 FO, and I get a new 1st Class every 12 months. PS-I hope you're enjoying retirement. It must be nice to look at all this junk knowing it no longer effects you. :) |
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