I don't think the gov has any authority to make airlines pay more, the only way airlines will pay more is if no one shows up at the door. The whole point, of scraping by with entry level flying is to get to a pro job. Who wouldn't bypass all that? You can't blame these mythical 250 hour pilots. There will never be a shortage all airlines have to do is lower the mins. That's why they need to pass this ATP bill, it will be very bad the next couple of years for people affected but in the long run it will be better. It's not like they're missing out on much the first and second year under current regional work rules, except for that shinny jet..

 

I wonder how enrollment compares at the FBO flight schools.

When I got my ratings a couple years ago, I did it one hour at a time at a local FBO. Pay as you go. Of course that option is way cheaper but generally takes longer. At that time, I thought about places like DCA but chose the longer and less expensive option.

I think there can be a legitimate reason for paying more at a DCA type program. The old adage that time = money. If you can pay more but enter the job market at a more advantageous time, it might be worth it.

There are no jobs to slide into at this time. Anyone doing their homework now would look into the local FBO option with the goal of being ready when hiring resumes.

If we are in the middle of a hiring frenzy where companies are lowering mins and hiring immediately, it might be worth it shell out some extra bucks for the timing.

 

Wow! This thread has some convoluted concepts, considering the sources.

Funding's GONE from the aviation schools, military flying has been cut drastically, and age 65 will happen. I personally believe ATP rule will pass, simply because Babbit (FAA) has never taken the regionals seriously, especially as ALPA Pres. The airlines won't raise prices, (they know price is king for e-tickets) and parking ever larger amounts of jets in the desert will reach a point of diminishing returns. European-style ab-initio won't work in this country. Weeding out large numbers of pilots in training and then paying a good wage for 250hrs. experience doesn't compute when an airline has to actually generate a profit, or at least try.

I keep hearing that prospective budding airline pilots build hours flying 135 (most require 1,200hrs+and are not hiring), flight instructing, crop-dusting, etc...please tell me where these jobs are so I can again be gainfully employed. Anyone?

One poster here thinks regionals need to start @$70k/year. Any facts or figures used to come to this conclusion should immediately be rushed to your MEC!

 

And if Congress has its way, we might be looking at the need for first officers to have an ATP, a requirement that will add tens of thousands of dollars to these students' debt, making it more difficult for students to get loans and for school to attract young people to their programs. For the record, no one at the conference thought the right-seat ATP provision would improve safety.



Don't you mean.....
"Earn tens of thousand while at the same time gaining invaluable experience that will last a lifetime."

 

Unfortunately, many people believe that there is a direct correlation between forking out tons of cash and receiving a quality education. It's too bad tha Riddle has fallen to such depths. Albeit it was 20 years ago when I go my education there, cost then were alot less.



atp

 

Hi!

ATP mins is a big unknown...it will affect things A LOT, and no one knows how it will go down. I would not be surprised if it passed now, but in two years, as airlines get desperate, if it was rescinded.

Ab Initio could work very well here. I guarantee the foreign airlines that have done it for years, are trying their best, just like the US airlines, to make a profit. Airlines will proabably be forced to go to an Ab-Initio program, at some point.

cliff
NBO
PS-If you want to teach, and you go through the standard university program, you are REQUIRED to PFT! You can get around this by finding a district that is desperate, but we saw how that turned out in the airline industry....which regionals were desparate, and what were those jobs like?

Starting pay in 2000, at the 2nd highest paying district in WI was 24,000/year. Normally, you can not get this much pay after graduation. You have to substitute teach for a year or more, and/or take a job at with very low pay: way out in the boonies, inner city, or at a private school.

 

Gee, ya think? I would imagine the conversation with the "industry experts" would follow the same logic as tobacco execs claiming their product doesn't cause cancer. Follow the money.

Did anyone else read that article and see it as an annual re-cap of the flight training forum?

 

The only shortage is Jobs and movement. This is good for the industry and good for pilots. We have way to many yahoos willing to work for nothing. Just to tell some chic "I'm an Airline Pilot".

 

"A Crisis in Flight Training"

Of course those flight school owners consider this a crisis. Only those people who have a true passion for aviation would consider flight training today. If I owned a pilot mill I would be panicking too! The gig is up! People know they will have to plan on making a career at a garbage regional. People know about the low pay and horrible work rules, it has been splashed on the front page of every newspaper the past several months.
Just remember, when the economy turns around, regional airlines will still be paying peanuts and treating pilots like trash. Same goes for many corporate and 135 operators. Mainline jobs are becoming a thing of the past. Job security? Retirement? QOL? Why would anyone want a part of this? Anyone have the number of that truck-driving school?

 

I agree there is a storm around the corner. It was part diverted by the age 65 but as soon as that happens retirements are going to happen faster than ever before. Statistics show that retirements are going to double the amount of new commercial ratings issued by year 2015.
Is that going to drive up wages? Not if management can help it. They are going to push for pilot factories and swear up and down that Riddle grads are a step above. Don't think pilot factories are going to be the only survivors though. They won't be able to keep up with the demand in the next 5 years. Can mom and pop schools wait it out?