You hit all the important stuff on the XJ contract.

Being on the 9E side of things now, i can tell you that the XJ contract is much better. For example we were told that if you are on your day off, had a beer or live out of base and you accidentally pick up your phone, if you aren't able to show up for the junior man, you have to use up a call in honest.

Also XJ's commuter policy is unlimited vs pinnacle's 2 times a year. XJ does only allow you to use delta flights to comply with the 2 flight requirement.

I start OE next week, so I'll give an updated assessment soon. :P

Are you serious? What moron told you this? If you pick up your phone on your day off (another discussion/issue; if you do, that's you're own fault), and you're drinking, you don't say you can't accept the assignment. You're on a recorded line. Say, I will accept the assignment however I need 12 hours to be legal to fly. They're going to slap a Jr. Man refusal on you anyways, no matter what you say, so you might as well accept the assignment but tell them you need whatever buffer you do to get to work. They'll say thanks and hang up. Quick base management meeting and you're gold.

I suppose you can just flat out refuse without an excuse, but that could be harder to get away with.

Also, within 72 hours you are not obligated to drop everything and get to work, so "prior commitment" is acceptable.

That's not exactly true.. You get coded NFA by scheduling (the equivalent of a missed trip) and get to take it up with your (non-pilot) base manager later who has the final say on the outcome. Usually not a big deal since upper management fired all the base managers a few years ago then made them reapply for their old jobs at less pay--they are a lot less eager to do Nonconnah's dirty work.

Basically you just don't ever answer your phone. The company would rather play gotcha games than let you say "no, I can't cover that today, I'm in California. But I can help you out in two days..."

Too d@mn stupid and mean-spirited.

Thanks guys. That was what was said in training. They said a lot of things... I guess I'll learn the ins and outs on the line.

Not all true. I'm not sure who you've been talking to, but if you pick up the phone and can't legally fly it, it is not coded as a CIH. Iniatially it is coded as a junior assignment refusal (I don't agree with this) until you talk to your base manager. You'll need to submit a simple report about why you were unavailable and then it will be coded as a junior man excused. Not that you should have to jump through these hoops, but it is what it is. It does not count toward the call in honest policy.

On the important stuff your payrates are better than ours. 401k is just slightly better, unless your super senior, and our insurance is quite a bit better than yours. Vacation is pretty much the same, except we have vacation slide.

We need to build on each others contracts, not argue who's is better. For the person that said "you're welcome", you should read both contracts. They're available online to anyone who has the time to do a little research. We don't owe anyone a "thank you". Instead maybe you should spend your time looking them both over, along with contracts of our peers, and making suggestions on what you would like to see on the next contract.

Couldn't have said it better myself, this single contract needs to be better then all of our current contracts.

I would say QOL is "important stuff" which you failed to mention...XJ's contract in that regard is 10 times better...have yet to meet any 9E pilot that says otherwise.

On paper your contract looks better, but I'm going to go out on a limb and say some of what you consider "better" might be "worse" once some key players from 9E Management get their hands on it...rest assured, they are picking through every WORD in your contract as we speak (if they haven't already) looking for EVERY possible way to blow you out of the water on any "conflict" that arises on a scheduling or pay issue...Barney, FF, and SL are pros at twisting things in their favor, and they know exactly where the razor-thin border is between doing things the FAA/arbitrator will come after them on, and doing things that will let them duck under the radar/regs....

With your min day, all Pinnacle is going to do is spread the flying out to exactly 4 hours of flying per pilot per day, and the way THEY use PBS, everyone will have 11 day off lines....it WILL help reserves, but will significantly decrease days off for lineholders, who currently get 14-20 days off (if you bid max days off@75-80 hours line), with the exception of the last 10-15 lines...

Our health insurance is stellar...would be good to keep that...it costs almost nothing--$5 generics, $10 name-brand...they cover almost anything, and out of pocket expenses are extremely low...it's contractual and won't change significantly even if they switch companies...

Copying and pasting XJ's contract + 9E's vacation slide & Health Insurance could lead to some unforeseen consequences once Barney et al. get a hold of it....that's all I'm saying...

I would beg to differ. While your contract has more money in it than ours, I can hold 17-19 days off a month.When I bid for vacation many times I can get at least 3 weeks off. Some more senior guys can get more, while the more junior guys get less. The question is what constitutes "QOL"? Is it time off, being put up in decent hotels, commutable trips, better pay, better health care for you and your family, longer vacation, better retirement, pass benefits, CIH and JR man refusals, days off for reservists, or all the above? Me personally I'm in the "all the above category". Something which the Mesaba contract is lacking and why I voted no on the last TA.

I can't speak for the other pilots, but I don't care where they put the money in our contract. For example, if they decided to give us an industry leading wage, I'll fund my own 401K. Better work rules, maybe we'll consider health care. Good work rules and I'll sacrifice a day or two off a month. Bottom line is I don't want to come out of this with less money in the contract than when we went into these negotiations.

Well I guess it would be interesting to see where you fit on the seniority system with that regard, sounds like you have it pretty nice. I would say the top 20% of CA's and FO's at XJ probably feel the same way as you. But for us middle and bottom feeders, not so fortunate...I would give up a dollar of pay per hour to have another day off if that means spending more time with my family, maybe you wouldn't. Everyone's different and has different desires, high seniority guys want pay, low seniority guys want pay and days off so we aren't going to see eye to eye on all of this. Just saying I've read alot of comments on APC about how abismal 9E's current contract is. I would be curious though to see your guys latest TA proposal to see if it is anything close to XJ's current contract, but then again curious as to why our contract is lacking, compared to 9E's?