I empathize with what you are saying. Many pilots at the regionals feel trapped like there isnt any way out and they are forced to spend every day wondering if their Legacy "partner" is going to pull the rug out from under them as well.

The Regionals have become a social stratification project. Legacy management created a system where they can get airplanes to move passengers from point A to B, and do it with cheaper labor. The system is flawed to say the least and there will be, unfortunately, many qualified pilots at regionals who may not ever get hired by a Major. Just like there are many who are less qualified who are receiving job offers as of this moment because of who they are or who they know. Its a game not based on ability.

When I said that the OP was selling himself short, it was not in reference to Regional pilots. I worked at a regional, a crappy one, and was fortunate to get on with a LCC. How? Combination of of a lot of things, but luck is always the big one. "Selling yourself short" was what I believed PSA to have done when they agreed to further increase the disparity between a Regional pilot and a Major pilot. I know that the PDT TA has a provision included it which the company increases health care costs for pilots everytime more jets are delivered on property, I dont know if this is also true with PSA and their CBA.

 

Get a clue man. It has nothing to do with "not being worthy." Nobody is saying that any Regional pilot "isn't worthy." I flew junky turbo props at a regional before leaving. It has everything to do with not being entitled, something you are coming off as being.

You said that there are many qualified pilots at the Regionals, tons of experience, who should be given a chance at the Legacy carrier. But then your solution is to make this "combined list" only inclusive to PSA, Envoy, and PDT. What about the thousands of other qualified regional pilots at other regionals? You feel entitled to be given a pass before any other hard working pilot; regional, 135, 91, charter, military, etc simply because there are fewer dots to connect your regional airline to Legacy AA than there are for another pilot's regional. Thats entitlement.

And you could not be any further from the truth to think that the average CA and FO at a Major/LCC/Legacy carrier was on average hired at 2500 TT these days. My airline alone has a hard minimum of 4000TT and short of being very very well connected, or military, Id be willing to bet that the average pilot getting hired at a Legacy these days is well north of 2500TT

 

I doubt you even know what entitled means. I know it's a buzz word for this decade but it's being used in the wrong manner. Kinda like the f word. It's good but then it's being construed as bad. When someone works hard for something, more often than not they are entitled to reimbursement. Not a bad thing. But you are implying that because we work at a regional we are not entitled to further our career. Even after we have twice or three times the experience you had. I believe the person that has the negative entitlement is you. Your entitled to fly a mainline jet but regional pilots are not, because your less experience was better.
20 years ago Mainline was giving up scope for pay. Today we have 50-90 seat jets flying east coast to west coast. Regional flying?
And all you care about is your beloved seniority number. This industry keeps selling out the next generation of pilots yet blame them for protecting their own interests.
We have an opportunity to merge the wholly owned carriers. I don't want eagles 700's, they don't want me to have them. Send the airplanes over but send the pilots with them. Am I coming off as entitled? If that means 1 seniority list with 6 airlines then so be it. If you care about your friends at eagle you will give it some thought.

 

Again, you are clueless to what you are even saying and what I asked you directly. Your original position again was that you should automatically be given a number at AA because your badge looks like theirs and an Endeavor or ASA pilot's badge does not, and my response and challenge to it was:

You said that there are many qualified pilots at the Regionals, tons of experience, who should be given a chance at the Legacy carrier. But then your solution is to make this "combined list" only inclusive to PSA, Envoy, and PDT. What about the thousands of other qualified regional pilots at other regionals? You feel entitled to be given a pass before any other hard working pilot; regional, 135, 91, charter, military, etc simply because there are fewer dots to connect your regional airline to Legacy AA than there are for another pilot's regional. Thats entitlement.

Defend your position on that. You keep saying "We" and "You". Im not involved in this. I dont work for AA. I want to know why you think you are entitled to that spot at AA MORE than a pilot flying for a regional that isnt PSA, PDT, or Envoy? Or more entitled than any other pilot who meets the minimum hiring requirement.

And the irony for you to say "This industry keeps selling out the next generation of pilots yet blame them for protecting their own interests" So ironic, its sad.

You correct, you are not entitled, your attitude is that of entitlement. Want to work at AA, set yourself apart like everyone else trying to get on there. Play the game, make connections, strengthen your skills to improve on your clear deficiency with reading comprehension.

 

Very well said. This is the conundrum I internally wrestle with. I feel very much that I'm damned if I do and damned if I don't. Like most pilots, I want to raise the industry bar, but when I went to a place with a new decent to good contract, bankruptcy soon followed....

 

It's tough. Addressing the collective issue of regional airlines logically, I come up with the following...


It would benefit current regional pilots if CPA flying didn't exist. We'd gain in every possible area. It would benefit current major/legacy pilots in that adding huge amounts of pilots to the bottom of the list would greatly increase relative seniority. We'd all gain in the area of collective bargaining ability and leverage. Major carriers would no longer have to waste effort and bargaining power on recapturing lost scope, and could thus devote effort to more fruitful endeavors.

There's a general feeling I get from most major carriers' pilots that moving up from a regional must be earned, not given. They had to earn it, why shouldn't we? Conversely, there's a general feeling among regional pilots that we move the same people on the same tickets as our mainline counterparts, under the same name. We provide the same transportation service you do, simply in a different airframe for less pay, and usually with less experience. How do we bridge this gap?

There is a large part of the overall capacity that is currently flown by CPA. The capacity would need to remain more or less intact. The frequency also needs to stay.... As no matter what people think, you can't replace 5 flights on a Brasilia with a single 737 and expect the same financial result. Regional airlines have already started to feel the squeeze of a pilot supply issue, some more than others. What will be interesting to see is what happens in situations where a major carrier hasn't historically played "musical airplanes" with their feed. American might be able to shovel airplanes from one company to the next to exploit the SJS flavor of the week, but a company like Alaska would find it much more difficult to staff their feed.

Ending the CPA idea would help all of us... But it would take cooperation.

Would mainline pilots tolerate having a wholly-owned regional carrier stapled to the bottom of their list, if it meant bringing all of their brand's flying in-house? Could they live with the idea that the junior airplane at a Legacy might be an RJ-200, and that a small group of pilots below them might have received a bit of a windfall?

If not... Then what is the solution? Keep fighting for scope in each new contract? That requires other sacrifices. Or is re-claiming scope simply not a priority? I don't see many other options.

All that said, management doesn't stand to gain from any of this unless staffing their feed becomes almost impossible. So it's all kind of pointless.