As I read some of the responses I am struck by the generic tone of some of the negative responses. I hope these are seen as the emotional outbursts that they are and ignored. Delta has taken complete control over Endeavor. They manage the product and share several systems. This is much different than other airlines they have owned in the past. The key point and the goal most should have when approaching a regional is getting the experience they need to make the jump to a Major. Endeavor is once again moving into position as being a great stepping stone. A stepping stone with positive ties to Delta which will help in career progression. At the end of the day upgrades will be starting soon and when they start they will continue until the next bad thing happens that halts them which will affect everyone. In the meantime a new hire can enjoy the highest compensation for a first year regional FO in the industry. See past the rhetoric and analyze your decision closely. Try hard to ignore emotional claims and focus on logic.

 

Here are some facts:

-The end fleet plan is still 81 airplanes = another year of no upgrades and a further deterioration of QOL for everyone but the most senior.

-The loss of 166 SSP spots a year = another year of no upgrades and a further deterioration of QOL for everyone but the most senior.

-300 to 400 lifers who have no plans to leave and just got a 15K raise = the possibility that upgrades will NEVER happen.

-Constant fleet movement between bases = a bad QOL for those junior in category as monthly movements between bases causes displacements.

-This company has a history of breaking promises (XJ flow, the original intent of the SSP, the 9E How We Fly brochure, the new EtD SSP numbers, Q4 being our turn around quarter . . .) making it hard to believe anything they tell us.

-A realistic upgrade timeline for a new hire coming online today? I'd say not until the top 400 retire, so 10 years?

The only thing left to make 9E a desirable place to work is fleet growth and a flow/FIRM commitment from Delta with ironclad language on a defined path to Delta. If you want to gamble your career on those two things happening then why not give it a go.

So far I haven't seen any facts that would encourage a new hire to come to Endeavor or a current FO to stay. Why don't you list some out? It seems to me you are the one being more emotional than logical on the topic. An inside feeling that something good is going to happen at 9E isn't enough when other airlines are hiring straight into the left seat.

 

Exactly this, I've had a great time working with everyone from Pinnacle to Endeavor. I kept thinking it would get better, and stuck it out. Looking back I wish I would have left at least a year ago. They don't want people to leave, at the delta interviews they are actually telling people that they can't hire all the SSPs the first time around. That would hurt Delta's invested interest in Endeavor.

 

Reading your post makes me think you don't know what a fact is. Endeavor flies aircraft made by Bombardier (fact). There are 3-400 lifers at 9e(opinion).

 

In order to be a "great stepping stone" (which sounds more like an emotional claim to me rather than one based on logic) there has to be upgrades and they have to happen fast. Instead of making claims like these provide us with evidence. Do some math to show how one can come/stay at Endeavor and get the required PIC to move on to mainline. Explain your logic because to me it looks like you are doing the same exact thing you are accusing the other side of doing - using emotion to make your point.

 

That is not an opinion, I have gone through the seniority list multiple times and without calling up the top 500 pilots it is as close to fact as we are going to get. We have AT LEAST 300 pilots that are not going to leave from here until a shutdown is announced. Care to go through some of my other points? I don't see how the fact that 9E flys Bombardier aircraft is going to get anyone to come here. Two can play this game, fact: Endeavor has two bases in the NY area. Opinion: Endeavor will be a great stepping stone.

 

There are lifers at every regional. So you are suggesting that going to a different regional will help you avoid lifers. That is the nature of the business. With all regional shrinking to some degree and lifers holding steady at every regional...what is the best choice?

By the way, you don't have to upgrade to move on. Plenty of FO's have gone to JetBlue and Spirit for example.

 

TSA is taking street captains. You who are smart would go.

 

Thanks Yoda.

 

I don't know what the best choice is but your side of the argument is calling the other side out for being emotional but yet I still haven't seen anything to back up your claim that 9E is a good decision. The fact that every regional has lifers is not a good enough argument to get people to work at 9E. Things like great base locations (not in NY), good schedules (which usually comes via upward movement), 10 new airplanes coming, 300 pilots a year going to Delta, positive space travel to work or a defined clear path to Delta would get people to come work here. If you happen to be in a small subset of people who does not care about PIC and you think you can get to your career airline without it then yes, I agree, 9E might be the place for you. If you live in NY, come for 2 years and get the bonus. Other than that subset of people what else is there for 9E to offer potential candidates and current FO's? I'm not seeing anything right now other than some far off promise of something good MIGHT happen.