Visual Approach - Page 4 - Airline Pilot Central Forums

#31

USMCFLYR , 02-12-2009 09:49 AM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by caboarder2001

***OK SO WE ALL AGREE THAT WE HAVE TO LISTEN TO TOWER INSTRUCTIONS, OR IN THE CASE OF LOST COMM'S WE FLY THE PATTERN AND LOOK FOR A LIGHT GUN*** But now here's another question...

How are we supposed to know what the correct pattern direction is? We don't have the answer to that question in any of our binders or manuals. And lets be honest...When was the last time ANYONE flying 121 has ever bought a VFR chart or AFD?

I know everyone is going to say use your own judgment, but what is the correct and official way to go about this?

What Rickair said - - and clear your flight path if nothing else. I don't need that to be written down.

USMCFLYR

#32

ExperimentalAB , 02-12-2009 09:57 AM

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rickair's got it...just think of every runway configuration you've ever experienced at a hub, and you'll find that the direction of pattern is a no-brainer. Remember...just keep in mind the runways being used for departures and arrivals and it's quite clear.

#33

SmoothOnTop , 02-12-2009 10:03 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by rickair7777

There is a reason that we launch inboard, land outboard. Don't cross someone else's departure path.

Ever been to KPHL, typical winds day???

#34

Blkflyer , 02-12-2009 10:13 AM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ToiletDuck

1. Throw yourself at the runway really fast and try to miss at the last second.
2. Backup with ILS is a good idea in general esp with an airport that has multiple parallel runways. Sometimes in the haze people want to line up on the wrong one.
3. If you're visual then you go missed visual. Usually even if you have a published missed, when shooting an actual approach, at a busy airport as soon as you tell them "going missed" they will probably assign you a heading but always be prepared.

There's a link here of when the Chautauqua ERJ got stuck in the grass at JFK. Listen to it and you'll hear the controller telling everyone to go missed and giving them all vectors because they were cleared for the visual.

**On a side note when you check in with approach they tell you which runway to expect. You brief that approach and, correct me if I'm wrong, but if they say "Turn heading 150 intercept the LOC for runway 12 mainting 3.5k at or above XXX clear for the visual" they are still able to give you the published missed because you accepted the clearance to take the LOC which means you are prepped and ready for the published missed.

Duck I have to disagree with you on this.. the controller telling you to turn to a specific heading to intercept the LOC for runway abc maint 3.5k at or above xxx is the same as them saying Maintain 210 till the marker they know your aircraft suffix when you file "in our world dispatch" and will issue clearance based on that. The moment the controller says cleared for the Visual and you accept it. Its now a VISUAL approach I dont know of any missed approach procedure associated with a visual. Its Called a Go Around and is done with the Tower or in the case of a non towered field the recommend traffic pattern.

If its a Visual I back it up with the ILS for situational awareness But I always brief if we need to go around we will do it with the tower

If is an ILS or any type of Instrument approach for that matter I always say if we have to go missed we will fly the published missed unless Tower tells us other wise

#35

skidmark , 02-12-2009 12:00 PM

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The real question is why would you go missed if you have a perfectly good taxiway to land on?

#36

Tinpusher007 , 02-12-2009 02:56 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by skidmark

The real question is why would you go missed if you have a perfectly good taxiway to land on?

Because then you get to explain your perfectly good taxiway landing to the FAA and go back for re-training IF you don't get fired...like that CO crew did last year was it?

#37

Tinpusher007 , 02-12-2009 02:57 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SmoothOnTop

Ever been to KPHL, typical winds day???

Or KCLE for that matter? I've never understood the logic at either airport.

#38

Tinpusher007 , 02-12-2009 02:59 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ExperimentalAB

Good question...if I have time I might set up an ILS, but I'll typically keep my head out the windscreen where it is supposed to be on a visual. Don't go too fast, slow, and don't overshoot (in the case of parallels), and you're golden.

Why wouldn't you or better yet, the other pilot have time to set up the ILS? Even if you don't want to be bothered loading it in the FMS, you could still dial in the freq and just fly it 'green needles'. Doesn't your company direct you to always back up a visual approach with all applicable navaids?

#39

shfo , 02-12-2009 03:12 PM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by caboarder2001

How are we supposed to know what the correct pattern direction is? We don't have the answer to that question in any of our binders or manuals. And lets be honest...When was the last time ANYONE flying 121 has ever bought a VFR chart or AFD?

Look at for the segmented circle around the windsock

I think it's funny when some captains brief the "missed" on a visual. "Yeah we'll uh fly runway heading to 540 then left turn via XXX radial to 12.8 DME and hold south west it will be a parallel entry." Like you'd actually do that on a clear and a million day.

#40

ToiletDuck , 02-12-2009 03:19 PM

Che Guevara

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blkflyer

There's a reason I put that part in bold

Like I said on my #3 if you're visual then go missed visual but I couldn't remember if they could simply say "fly the published missed".