no I said that as sarcasm and for any naysayers against you guys

I am a former military guy, currently a regional FO. About 4000 total, with about 1500 PIC in the military. Would I be competitive at Spirit without internal recs? And can a new hire get based at DTW?

If you were hired right now, approximately how long would it take to be a lineholder in DFW?

In no particular order:

The good:
- Commuter friendly contract
- 4 days off between block except transition
- Average 2 legs per day, average 2h+ per legs (I expect this to change over time for the worse, some bases like LAS do have 4-5 legs per day but still not on average).
- There is OT and some guys living in base are making real good money working their asses off which compensates for the low base pay... but only for those who are willing to destroy their QOL. It gets better with seniority. But it is hard when you can't hold a line or commute. So for most it is the base pay only.
- Schedule integrity, no reassignment without the consent of the crewmemeber, this is true even on reserve once you get an assignment you can't be reassigned.
- You can drop trips without pay or for vacation as long there is reserve coverage, no need to call either all done online.
- 100% pay protection for all cancellations.
- 100% Deadheading pay... not a lot of deadheading either.
- 90% of the time good layover hotels.

The bad:
- Below industry standard base pay... and it is here to stay for many years. I doubt we will get a raise before 2019.
- Horrible 1st year pay $38. United is $61. Who is gonna come here once the legacies will be in full swing? I have no idea. Poor training pay, a flat $1700/month.
- Low block trips (some 4 days finishing with a redeye paying only 15h... ouch. Most 4 days pay 18h. Still very low.)
- No block or better.
- Pay protection is averaged to 4.5h per day on multiday trip so lots of trips have a big day followed by a short day, and end up paying only 4.5h per day or less. Lots of hotel time.
- Lots of red eye flying. The fleet has the highest utilization in the industry. Planes fly all around the clock. So do we. I suddenly have gray hair all over.
- Horrible MX. Especially in the past few months. I have seen airplanes with 20-30 MELs. Right now we are downgraded to CAT I only fleetwide. Like a C172. Mechanics are leaving all the time so attrition is high. Plus the planes fly all the time so there is no time to fix. The result is ongoing MX delays and me filing countless MX related ASAPs. Fun.

The big picture:
- Growing airline copying the Ryan Air model (I think their net income was 400mill Euros or so in 2012 in a tougher environment). We are still only serving 1% of the market. So the opportunity is huge. If our growth will look like anything Ryan's was File:Ryanair pax fig.JPG - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia this place will be huge. Projection is 200 planes by 2020. I am not saying that it will happen.
- Spirit has no debt so we are in a decent position to survive if things turn for the worse.
- Horrible customer service.
- Highest complaints rate in the nation.

This is just some stuff on top of my head. I guess right now we have a ton of people applying and it is hard to get in. But that will change soon. I can also see a lot of FOs leaving for the legacies in 2013 and on.

I am here, left set soon, so I am not going anywhere. If our growth happens as projected I am sure we will get a contract with good base pay next time around. And the fast movement eventually compensates those who are willing to be in the right seat for 3-4 years. Although pay may be better at AA or UAL or DAL, since you won't see the left seat for 10-15 you will end up making more here. But you have to survive 1st year.

I hope this helps...

I really wish people would stop comparing this job to a regional. Yes, it is better than a regional. It should be. You're not an intern anymore. Keep comparing yourselves to a regional, and the company will start doing the same.

Normann, don't confuse trip averaging with not having block or better. We have block or better. If you fly an LGA turn blocked at 7.2 and you come in at 7.5 you get paid for it. The averaging is only over a multiple day trip and if you go over block on all of them you get the higher pay of the block or the trip rig depending on which one is more.

Trip averaging still sucks and we need to get rid of it. Ram is right. If we keep compairing our pay and QOL to the regionals we will never better our contract.

I meant block or better per leg basis. We only have it per trip. I.e. at RAH they have it per leg. If they go over on that LGA turn by 5 min on leg one, and under by 5 min on the return leg, they get paid 5 min extra. We don't.

Anyone, anyone?

A few months, maybe 2 to 4. Newhires and upgrading captains are all being sent there according to the latest vacancy bids.

How senior is LAS? It that a really small base? Is it pretty much all 4 day trips? Or is it possible for 2days or Day trips??