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TFAYD 02-16-2022 01:28 PM


Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 3373605)
BOI and SLC just saw 50 captains each awarded. Crazy times. Zero ability to predict anything. But movement fast!!

how is the trip mix changing? Not 4 days out of BOI and SLC? Doing MSP and other Midwest flying? Or is it still “native” BOI or SLC flying?

the point is - are they pushing flying into domiciles that people want or is mainline shifting it around?

herewego 02-16-2022 01:54 PM


Originally Posted by TFAYD (Post 3373649)

the point is - are they pushing flying into domiciles that people want or is mainline shifting it around?

No, they're upgrading people into domiciles they want, then will Send them OBR (Out of Base Reserve) to the bases very few want, but has the flying.
More expensive for the company to buy seats and hotel rooms, but at least they have the manpower to cover the flying.
Sucks for the pilot getting OBRed, but at least you don't need to worry about making your commute or paying for a crash pad, and you're getting paid per diem while sitting reserve.

brocklee9000 02-16-2022 02:03 PM


Originally Posted by herewego (Post 3373666)
No, they're upgrading people into domiciles they want, then will Send them OBR (Out of Base Reserve) to the bases very few want, but has the flying.
More expensive for the company to buy seats and hotel rooms, but at least they have the manpower to cover the flying.
Sucks for the pilot getting OBRed, but at least you don't need to worry about making your commute or paying for a crash pad, and you're getting paid per diem while sitting reserve.

Perhaps naïveté on my part since I've had about 3 total weeks of reserve ever and mostly based at home, but...how exactly does that suck for the OBRs? If they're going to get the $30+ pay raise to the left seat, whatever PIC bonuses they might be eligible for, probably got a couple months paid vacation due to the training backlog, and get to technically be domiciled at home. Sure, let's be real: it's not going to be a 5 day paid vacation at the airport layover; you'll get used every day. But it eliminates every problem of commuting, and being on reserve. Accommodations, per diem, guaranteed commute, and those DHs from PHX-DTW are going to start adding almost 8 hours of credit to each trip and that goes to guarantee.

So if anyone's main reason not to upgrade is because they know commuting to reserve is the worst thing ever, this seems pretty good. I know we'll never see home basing in 121, I wish. But it's enough to make me think about maybe considering upgrade some day. Commuting to the worst schedule as a barely-lineholder in DTW as a new hire, vs guaranteed commute+DH credit toward guarantee and duty limits+a hotel, I see the latter as better. You'd just get abused to hell at home anyway. My reserve captains sure hate their life and I know quite a few that bid out to commute to a line. Now these guys at home get positive spaced to OBR

herewego 02-16-2022 02:30 PM


Originally Posted by brocklee9000 (Post 3373671)
.how exactly does that suck for the OBRs?

When you get OBRed every reserve block and not used is when it sucks. Rather than getting the good hotels near things to do, with decent Gyms, you get stuck in the lousy hotels near the airport without a fridge or microwave.
Getting Stuck at the Wooley aint bad, but getting stuck at a red lion with only a cold breakfast is much more likely.
Being home domiciled with a positive space seat to your OBR with a paid hotel and per diem is much better than commuting the day prior to a crash pad and commuting home the day after, but being a senior FO with a cush schedule has kept many from taking the upgrade.

brocklee9000 02-16-2022 08:05 PM


Originally Posted by herewego (Post 3373686)
When you get OBRed every reserve block and not used is when it sucks. Rather than getting the good hotels near things to do, with decent Gyms, you get stuck in the lousy hotels near the airport without a fridge or microwave.
Getting Stuck at the Wooley aint bad, but getting stuck at a red lion with only a cold breakfast is much more likely.
Being home domiciled with a positive space seat to your OBR with a paid hotel and per diem is much better than commuting the day prior to a crash pad and commuting home the day after, but being a senior FO with a cush schedule has kept many from taking the upgrade.

Sure some of the airport hotels aren’t great, but they’re also not Ramada and Red Lion level of awful. My extremely short stint on reserve in summer 2019 saw me getting full trips to fill out my 2-3 weeks of reserve, and I got better 900 trips than the mostly 200 trips I could barely bid for and cling to a line. I’m not saying it’s going to be OBR at PSP or long DEN. What’s most likely going to happen is OBR to DTW, since that DVR seems to keep going unfilled. And if you get OBRd that far, I bet DHs are going to eat up most of your first and last day. That short layover was the commute hotel I used the most in DTW, it’s not bad. Even if it ends up being ready mixed with the usual bogus reserve flights, I would still take that over a 5am rap at home then fighting traffic in a 7am callout to do whatever abusive PHX CA stuff they’re about to do to you. I don’t fly with reserve captains here in PHX very often but they hate it so much. Not to say this OBR is a lot better, but I think it’s objectively better than the usual nonsense.

But essentially what I’m getting at is fat stacking new captains in their domicile of choice, obviously signals they will just farm you out as needed, where things are the most on fire, and you’re not just going to sit in the hotel for 5 days. Instead of trying your 3rd commute and just praying you get used, you’ll get flown out, lodged, and used.

I’m still clinging to my suddenly-amazing seniority in the right seat. We’ll see how it goes, but now that ULCCs are starting to call, every captain I know leaving for legacies, and most of my friends upgrading…let’s see what the next couple months hold.

SuperFlyCFI 02-17-2022 05:39 AM


Originally Posted by brocklee9000 (Post 3373843)
I’m still clinging to my suddenly-amazing seniority in the right seat. We’ll see how it goes, but now that ULCCs are starting to call, every captain I know leaving for legacies, and most of my friends upgrading…let’s see what the next couple months hold.

This is the part that has me worried. It took me 5 years, gave up a good paying job, finally got to 1500, training starts in June (maybe). Everybody here says FOs and CAs are leaving left right and center. The new hire classes are huge. By the time I get done in September how long will the wait for IOE be? will there be enough LCAs? And reserve is going to be how long?

All that whining aside, I'm not going back to the old job. No way. Just want to get started.

I'm gonna need y'all to upgrade and stay :)

amcnd 02-17-2022 05:44 AM


Originally Posted by SuperFlyCFI (Post 3373968)
This is the part that has me worried. It took me 5 years, gave up a good paying job, finally got to 1500, training starts in June (maybe). Everybody here says FOs and CAs are leaving left right and center. The new hire classes are huge. By the time I get done in September how long will the wait for IOE be? will there be enough LCAs? And reserve is going to be how long?

All that whining aside, I'm not going back to the old job. No way. Just want to get started.

I'm gonna need y'all to upgrade and stay :)

they are running LCA classes as we speak…

SuperFlyCFI 02-17-2022 06:07 AM


Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 3373970)
they are running LCA classes as we speak…

Good to hear. Thank you!

PossibleDeviation 02-17-2022 06:15 AM


Originally Posted by amcnd (Post 3373970)
they are running LCA classes as we speak…

The issue isn't that we aren't running LCA classes. The issue is that by the time those CAs have their Fed rides scheduled, half of the class has class dates at mainline carriers.

In all honesty I don't believe lacking LCAs is the main issue; it's our scheduling. I am currently waiting for CA IOE and on a daily basis I am seeing trips with LCAs in open time that are being assigned to FOs or broken up and split between reserve FOs. How does that make any sense?

amcnd 02-17-2022 06:57 AM


Originally Posted by PossibleDeviation (Post 3373980)
The issue isn't that we aren't running LCA classes. The issue is that by the time those CAs have their Fed rides scheduled, half of the class has class dates at mainline carriers.

In all honesty I don't believe lacking LCAs is the main issue; it's our scheduling. I am currently waiting for CA IOE and on a daily basis I am seeing trips with LCAs in open time that are being assigned to FOs or broken up and split between reserve FOs. How does that make any sense?


I agree. Then main issue is turnover in support staff at HDQ.. all new people in training scheduling, and it now falls under crew support not its own entity... That switch has made it very frustrating...


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