Does SKW honor seniority like a union shop?
06-01-2019, 08:31 AM
#51
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,203
Originally Posted by domino
How many bases has Skywest closed? Want me to list them for you too? Another lame argument. Your company colors are WAY too bright Mr. Company Guy.
Ask the same of all regionals that flew turboprops... base closing is a lame question.. (Air Wisconsin, denver.. Eagle, LA. SkyWest SMF, ExpressJet ONT, Comair all there basses ) ect.. The list goes on and on.. it’s about the next 10 years. How is that going to shake out..
06-01-2019, 10:42 AM
#52
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Joined APC: Apr 2010
Posts: 803
Originally Posted by amcnd
You don’t need to list them out. Im aware. the OO today is not the same as the 90’s... trust me..
Ask the same of all regionals that flew turboprops... base closing is a lame question.. (Air Wisconsin, denver.. Eagle, LA. SkyWest SMF, ExpressJet ONT, Comair all there basses ) ect.. The list goes on and on.. it’s about the next 10 years. How is that going to shake out..
Ask the same of all regionals that flew turboprops... base closing is a lame question.. (Air Wisconsin, denver.. Eagle, LA. SkyWest SMF, ExpressJet ONT, Comair all there basses ) ect.. The list goes on and on.. it’s about the next 10 years. How is that going to shake out..
And why did this take place? So the company didn't have dole out displacement pay!
Did the bases technically close, no. The equipment just changed. Did the pilots already there get to bid for the transition and hold their seniority in the base, again no! They got pushed out by junior people who were already trained on the plane. Is that how you see seniority being honored? The fact remains that many very senior CA's and FO's had to start commuting and moving to where the CRJ was. Commuting to sit on reserve after being a 10 to 15 year CA? That's just flat out wrong! No other airline, with a true enforceable contract, could or would do that. The company saved money, the pilots got jacked!
So if that's how you see displacement being fair and equitable and as expected, I'd say you are just the company pom-pom squad leader that management needs!
06-01-2019, 02:11 PM
#54
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,203
Im not saying OO is super perfect at the the way they do things. I should know. SAN is my home town. Seen that base come- go- come again. But you make it sound like every other alpa regional is butterflies and rainbows and don’t close basses or displace pilots.....
06-01-2019, 02:27 PM
#55
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Joined APC: Apr 2010
Posts: 803
Originally Posted by amcnd
Im not saying OO is super perfect at the the way they do things. I should know. SAN is my home town. Seen that base come- go- come again. But you make it sound like every other alpa regional is butterflies and rainbows and don’t close basses or displace pilots.....
That being said, I have a friend at D that has at least the next 5 weeks of with pay because he was displaced, poor guy right at the start of summer?
But what ALPA carriers have is an enforceable contract written without vagueness and single source interpretation, i.e. by management. ALPA carriers have a legal team at their disposal if the contract wasn't being complied with or at the very least it could be taken to court if the side of management and the pilot side looked at it different ways.
We don't have one damn thing!
We have zero protection!
But we a wonderful open door policy that is the envy of all carriers which is why we as a group of 5000+ pilots have it all figured out against the 60,000+ other pilots that have decided to protect themselves. I'm so proud! (((BARF)))
06-01-2019, 08:02 PM
#56
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Joined APC: Jul 2015
Posts: 859
Originally Posted by amcnd
Im not saying OO is super perfect at the the way they do things. I should know. SAN is my home town. Seen that base come- go- come again. But you make it sound like every other alpa regional is butterflies and rainbows and don’t close basses or displace pilots.....
06-01-2019, 10:24 PM
#57
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Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: EMB 145 FO
Posts: 425
Originally Posted by rickair7777
Day-to-day operations function exactly like a union shop.
They have a contract with the pilot group, and a representative body which serves a function similar to a union. All airlines are subject to the RLA (railway labor act) union or not.
The difference is that the pilot group has less leverage, since the contract is harder to enforce for minor violations. But in the regional world market forces play a larger role than any sort of labor organization, so there's no real difference between skywest and other regionals. Historically about 1/3 of skywest pilots came from other (union) regionals in search of greener pastures. There's a limit to what unions can do in the regional world, since they are outsourced subcontractors.
IMO it would be nice is they had a union, but I certainly would not make that a priority. Geography, upgrade opportunity, and QOL would be far more important.
They have a contract with the pilot group, and a representative body which serves a function similar to a union. All airlines are subject to the RLA (railway labor act) union or not.
The difference is that the pilot group has less leverage, since the contract is harder to enforce for minor violations. But in the regional world market forces play a larger role than any sort of labor organization, so there's no real difference between skywest and other regionals. Historically about 1/3 of skywest pilots came from other (union) regionals in search of greener pastures. There's a limit to what unions can do in the regional world, since they are outsourced subcontractors.
IMO it would be nice is they had a union, but I certainly would not make that a priority. Geography, upgrade opportunity, and QOL would be far more important.
06-02-2019, 01:03 AM
#58
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Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 2,035
Originally Posted by amcnd
Im not saying OO is super perfect at the the way they do things. I should know. SAN is my home town. Seen that base come- go- come again. But you make it sound like every other alpa regional is butterflies and rainbows and don’t close basses or displace pilots.....
I don't recall a single SAN crew member that ever guzzled the extreme amount of Kool-Aid that you seem to have... When were you based there?
06-02-2019, 05:25 AM
#59
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Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,203
Originally Posted by ReadyRsv
What you ARE saying, consistently and on every topic is that either ALPA won't be able to help at all or will be worse than SAPA. Most of these positions you take are baseless or logically flawed. These statements show you either fail to grasp the mechanics of your profession or have a personal dislike of unions which causes you to either delude yourself, lie, or both.
06-02-2019, 06:09 AM
#60
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Joined APC: Apr 2010
Posts: 803
Even if we put together a contract that didn't have favorable displacement language in it, at least we would know what to expect. Today the contract language would most likely be pattern styled from other successful contracts at other carriers.
But we don't, we don't have squat!
We have an unenforceable garbage document, written on charmin, that management can look at any way they want, or not at all.
If anybody is looking at ALPA as the panacea to all of our woes, then they need to educate themselves.
Having access to what 60,000 other pilots have would be a great start to giving this pilot group a better work environment. Is it going to fix everything perfect, again, no.
But we don't, we don't have squat!
We have an unenforceable garbage document, written on charmin, that management can look at any way they want, or not at all.
If anybody is looking at ALPA as the panacea to all of our woes, then they need to educate themselves.
Having access to what 60,000 other pilots have would be a great start to giving this pilot group a better work environment. Is it going to fix everything perfect, again, no.
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