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Old 08-02-2015, 09:29 PM   #71  
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Originally Posted by CBreezy View Post
It doesn't matter. This isn't about freedom of speech or liberty or any other uninformed philosophical human rights debate. You don't get to say whatever you want, unedited, on a private Web board. If the owner or facilitator doesn't like what is being said, he can remove it at will. If it even appears to be threatening or libelous, he can and will be held liable. So, stop comparing it to your "rights."
You are absolutely right, and I believe the domain name of the site was registered under the name of an individual pilot. But even if it wasn't does anybody think even for a second that that SkyWest would go to bat legally for any pilot or SAPA if lawsuits are filed (regardless weather they hold merit or not)?

I am not an ALPA supporter whatsoever at the regional level. Although, at least ALPA has some pretty deep resources at their disposal which would prove useful in issues like this. This just goes to show what an utterly impotent organization SAPA actually is.

Hooray for fear of litigation!!!
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Old 08-02-2015, 09:38 PM   #72  
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It doesn't matter. This isn't about freedom of speech or liberty or any other uninformed philosophical human rights debate. You don't get to say whatever you want, unedited, on a private Web board. If the owner or facilitator doesn't like what is being said, he can remove it at will. If it even appears to be threatening or libelous, he can and will be held liable. So, stop comparing it to your "rights."




I never at any time compared it to my "rights". I think you're confusing me with someone else.
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Old 08-02-2015, 09:59 PM   #73  
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Default Skywest (sapa) forum shut down!

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Originally Posted by ConnectionPilot View Post
It's relevant because he said he was ready for a union. I just asked why he was ready and why he thinks ALPA is a better step forward than what we have now.



I worked at Mesaba, then Pinnacle. Went through the bankruptcy and decided to leave before ALPA passed a contract WITH MANAGEMENT that the pilot group voted in, after being threatened they would lose their jobs if they voted no. A contract which anchored the race to the bottom. Do I blame the 9E guys for voting it in? Of course not. That's their livelihood and they have to have a job to survive.



Why don't I want ALPA at SkyWest? Because I am a lot happier at SkyWest than I was at 9E. Knowing I don't have to worry about a simple case of conflict of interest between ALPA at a regional and ALPA at a legacy. Things need to change, for sure, but that's not the answer.

Ok, I see where your coming from now. I understand your point of view. In reality, a pilot union is only as good as its MEC and the decisions they make. Each MEC is independent in the decisions they feel is best for their pilots. No one at ALPA national can compel any MEC to do anything. But even if you don't want ALPA, which is fine, you can also go independent.


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Originally Posted by JustAMushroom View Post
Wow. Suddenly so reasonable. I've gotten accustomed to the rants that this really stood out. It's a nice change.



I've said for a long long time this place needs representation that is enforceable. In my opinion there are many many jr and senior guys who are ready. And there are a few who will just never sign on. As SW guys see the rest of the industry pulling away and the propaganda of being the best paid, best work rules and best loved by management wears off and the obvious reality of thousands of dollars a year being left on the table hits home the guys sitting on the fence will come over. It's not just the reserve rules, insurance costs, ever changing interpretation of rules that will change minds. In my opinion it will be the undeniable fact we are being played that will open the eyes of most guys. If 2004, 2007, 2013 didn't open your eyes maybe 2015 will.

Well, I'm glad that people are starting to realize the propaganda of being best paid, best work rules, etc. We'll see what happens with the vote results.

Last edited by Nevets; 08-02-2015 at 10:10 PM.
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Old 08-03-2015, 04:44 AM   #74  
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They (airlines) need us more than we need them. See attached vintage ad.
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Old 08-03-2015, 05:14 AM   #75  
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I never at any time compared it to my "rights". I think you're confusing me with someone else.
I'm not talking just to you. This is a group conversation.
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:14 AM   #76  
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Time to get an ALPA drive. This is the time. Spread the word. We need volunteers.
Okayyyy... So, when we get the mythical BIG UNION on property, who's going to lead us? The same guys ya'll are attacking for being SGU puppets, that's who, nobody else wants to get involved, and very few could even be bothered to vote in an election. I don't expect better representation to suddenly materialize just because we go union.
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Old 08-03-2015, 10:59 AM   #77  
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People didn't like the pay package, ran out of logical arguments and descended into name calling then progressed to actual harassment. SAPA didn't want to be on the hook for ruining someone's career. The people who got banned should be THANKFUL the forums got taken down when they did, their lack of self-control and decorum could have landed them without a job... or worse.
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Old 08-05-2015, 08:38 PM   #78  
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Okayyyy... So, when we get the mythical BIG UNION on property, who's going to lead us? The same guys ya'll are attacking for being SGU puppets, that's who, nobody else wants to get involved, and very few could even be bothered to vote in an election. I don't expect better representation to suddenly materialize just because we go union.

The pilots on the organizing committee would most likely be the pool from which you would get the new blood.
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Old 08-05-2015, 11:46 PM   #79  
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People didn't like the pay package, ran out of logical arguments and descended into name calling then progressed to actual harassment. SAPA didn't want to be on the hook for ruining someone's career. The people who got banned should be THANKFUL the forums got taken down when they did, their lack of self-control and decorum could have landed them without a job... or worse.
A guy advocated we vote in the new contract cause he wants skywest to prosper at the expense of pilots having low pay (1.5% raise plus some bonus stuff that equates to one extra pay check a year and one more day off a month?). Whoopdy doo. Someone looked into the guy who advocated the yes vote and realized said pilot had a previous career and was financially secure. He had a nice big house and didn't need the income from Skywest. I congratulate him on his previous success but to go on the forum and tell those who rely on this industry to feed their wife and kids after spending years and $100,000 and up on an education is not cool. Some pilots were upset because a yes vote limits our bargaining ability to make flying a desirable and profitable career over the next 3 years. Republic is crashing, airlines are making millions and we are gonna settle for a tiny raise? You're right people are gonna be upset. Can't believe more people aren't upset. Are we that accepting of less than we deserve? Think back to your early days struggling financially as a student, flight instructor, cargo, charter, 135, when is the last time you had a weekend or Xmas off? We deserve better! Why did we vote this in?? Let's just settle for crappy pay and work rules when skywest made 30 million in 3 months???
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Old 08-05-2015, 11:47 PM   #80  
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Okayyyy... So, when we get the mythical BIG UNION on property, who's going to lead us? The same guys ya'll are attacking for being SGU puppets, that's who, nobody else wants to get involved, and very few could even be bothered to vote in an election. I don't expect better representation to suddenly materialize just because we go union.
We don't need alpa, we need pilots that are willing to push harder for big improvements. Find that first then we can talk about alpa.
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