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Old 08-01-2015, 08:50 PM   #41  
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Default Looks like the pre-school bash fest is back

Looks like the pre-school bash fest is back on-line, Enjoy.
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Old 08-01-2015, 08:55 PM   #42  
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I think it's funny that people are upset that sapa shut down the forums after repeated issues of a small group of pilots decided bullying and intimidating a fellow pilot is a reason for us to join alpa. Everyone has seen over the last few months the tone of the forums has turned into a confrontational environment. From a rep who only won (after losing his prior election) because no one else wanted to run and then posted daily with at times informative topics but than baiting with "mr lawn mower analogies" and how we should force delta, united, etc into paying us more so we could get paid more. When one pilot wanted to vote yes and explained his reason the "mob" decided to overstep the line and used intimidation to try and shame him. Yup that's a group of fellow pilots I want to share a cockpit with. Maybe not having the forums can calm some of these people down since they post what seems every moment they are not flying.

Now the fact that sapa changed the bylaws to change when a new hire could vote is very alarming and should be questioned and be held accountable for. As with other issues, the conspiracy issues and the constant hatred to anyone who might disagree is childish at best. Would voting in alpa change that? Prob not. Maybe those that are so unhappy with sapa should be more focused in LEAVING than trying to intimidate those that are comfortable for their own reasons.
I'm sure the pilots who decided to post what they posted think they did no wrong and would do it again. I'm sure anyone one of them would not appreciate it if the same was done to them. Karma has a way to coming around. Maybe that's why they are still at Skywest and haven't moved on. Hmmmmmm
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Old 08-01-2015, 09:28 PM   #43  
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Originally Posted by FaceBiter View Post
Back in a truncated fully moderated compacity. Which makes it even more of a joke after all the hardcore explanations from the new prez and his homeboys
I saw that, and I made a post that simply pointed pilots to the new subreddit, and it was denied and deleted!! Tell me how that violated the TOS? They're trying so hard to control the flow of information it's not even funny! SAPA has become even more of a joke than I ever thought possible.
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Old 08-01-2015, 10:03 PM   #44  
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Can I ask why? Where did you work before SkyWest?

How is that a relevant question, where did you work before?

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Originally Posted by FlyinRabbit88 View Post
Would voting in alpa change that? Prob not. Maybe those that are so unhappy with sapa should be more focused in LEAVING than trying to intimidate those that are comfortable for their own reasons.

Why does it have to be mutually exclusive? Why can't those that are unhappy SAPA, try to get a union and also be focused on trying to process in their career? It doesn't have to be one or the other.
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Old 08-01-2015, 11:27 PM   #45  
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How is that a relevant question, where did you work before?
It's relevant because he said he was ready for a union. I just asked why he was ready and why he thinks ALPA is a better step forward than what we have now.

I worked at Mesaba, then Pinnacle. Went through the bankruptcy and decided to leave before ALPA passed a contract WITH MANAGEMENT that the pilot group voted in, after being threatened they would lose their jobs if they voted no. A contract which anchored the race to the bottom. Do I blame the 9E guys for voting it in? Of course not. That's their livelihood and they have to have a job to survive.

Why don't I want ALPA at SkyWest? Because I am a lot happier at SkyWest than I was at 9E. Knowing I don't have to worry about a simple case of conflict of interest between ALPA at a regional and ALPA at a legacy. Things need to change, for sure, but that's not the answer.
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Old 08-02-2015, 12:14 AM   #46  
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New sapa forums are up
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Old 08-02-2015, 05:05 AM   #47  
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It's relevant because he said he was ready for a union. I just asked why he was ready and why he thinks ALPA is a better step forward than what we have now.

I worked at Mesaba, then Pinnacle. Went through the bankruptcy and decided to leave before ALPA passed a contract WITH MANAGEMENT that the pilot group voted in, after being threatened they would lose their jobs if they voted no. A contract which anchored the race to the bottom. Do I blame the 9E guys for voting it in? Of course not. That's their livelihood and they have to have a job to survive.

Why don't I want ALPA at SkyWest? Because I am a lot happier at SkyWest than I was at 9E. Knowing I don't have to worry about a simple case of conflict of interest between ALPA at a regional and ALPA at a legacy. Things need to change, for sure, but that's not the answer.
In the last 4 years Skywest has went downhill that I have been here and it is not going to get better. I am not an alpa cheer leader but the "that's the way we do it" is bull*******. The reserve rules are now worse than they were originally.

9E is now getting $20,000/year in bonus and we are going to vote in a 1.5% 3 year deal. Pilots are their own worse enemy's.
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Old 08-02-2015, 06:34 AM   #48  
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How is that a relevant question, where did you work before?




Why does it have to be mutually exclusive? Why can't those that are unhappy SAPA, try to get a union and also be focused on trying to process in their career? It doesn't have to be one or the other.
Wow. Suddenly so reasonable. I've gotten accustomed to the rants that this really stood out. It's a nice change.

I've said for a long long time this place needs representation that is enforceable. In my opinion there are many many jr and senior guys who are ready. And there are a few who will just never sign on. As SW guys see the rest of the industry pulling away and the propaganda of being the best paid, best work rules and best loved by management wears off and the obvious reality of thousands of dollars a year being left on the table hits home the guys sitting on the fence will come over. It's not just the reserve rules, insurance costs, ever changing interpretation of rules that will change minds. In my opinion it will be the undeniable fact we are being played that will open the eyes of most guys. If 2004, 2007, 2013 didn't open your eyes maybe 2015 will.
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:06 AM   #49  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ConnectionPilot View Post
It's relevant because he said he was ready for a union. I just asked why he was ready and why he thinks ALPA is a better step forward than what we have now.

I worked at Mesaba, then Pinnacle. Went through the bankruptcy and decided to leave before ALPA passed a contract WITH MANAGEMENT that the pilot group voted in, after being threatened they would lose their jobs if they voted no. A contract which anchored the race to the bottom. Do I blame the 9E guys for voting it in? Of course not. That's their livelihood and they have to have a job to survive.

Why don't I want ALPA at SkyWest? Because I am a lot happier at SkyWest than I was at 9E. Knowing I don't have to worry about a simple case of conflict of interest between ALPA at a regional and ALPA at a legacy. Things need to change, for sure, but that's not the answer.

The key phrase to your post is "pilots voted in"! Whether Delta held a gun to the MEC or not isn't relative to the fact that the pilots voted on these issues. Other than pay SAPA has carte Blanche allowances to vote in all "contract" changes with no I put from pilots. And while ALPA is only as good as its MEC they have significant limits to their ability to change any/all of the contract without LEC/reps input and eventually all pilots voting. Our group has gone backwards from where we started heading in 2007/2008, namely a more independent board that listened to pilots. Now Sapa is isolated and our "officers" are spending too much time in SGU and think they know what's best for us.

It's time for a change of venue. Not because skywest is such an awful place, but because they are no longer playing the same game as when SAPA was established. And now Sapa thinks they are "fighting" for us by voting in proposals like "reflow 1-2-3"! Or allowing the company to deal on our behalf over jumpseats. Or allowing the company to dictate a change to policy that now has all crews on any DH (including training) to be a slightly elevated non rev status (even though it used to say differently). Just a few examples of SAPA's willingness to be agreeable and pilots having no say in the matter.....or for that matter not being able to at least hold up our contract in court.
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:40 AM   #50  
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They banned me from posting in the forums because I posted about our new subreddit way of communicating. This is getting ridiculous.

EDIT: They banned me from the entire SAPA website. Anyone mind messaging me a list of reps and a way to contact them?
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