Podcast: Frm. Spirit CEO Airline Trends
02-08-2021, 11:47 PM
#31
Strike averted!
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Position: B737
Posts: 3,647
Originally Posted by acecrackshot
If you are a Southwest pilot, this is one ironic post.
Personally, I think that WN is focusing on specifically United's market share in ORD/IAH/DEN.
.
Personally, I think that WN is focusing on specifically United's market share in ORD/IAH/DEN.
.
02-09-2021, 10:14 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,445
Originally Posted by Macjet
I operate several routes where anywhere from 10-20% of the airplane are people who drove 3+ hours to get on Spirit and avoid Southwest. They tell me it's that much cheaper and worth the time and hassle. I don't think F9 and NK are competing against just each other. If we were, WN wouldn't focus so heavily on the 'free' bag nor would AA/UA offer a 3rd class product. The ULCC's aren't in any danger of dragging pax out of B6 Mint, the WN small business crowd, or DL first class but there's lots of lower hanging fruit that's up for grabs. There's a lot of churn at the bottom that's looking at $$$ and not much else.
That must be a fun survey to do. Do you pass it out when you board and then collect them when you deplane?
Sorry I hurt your feelings. I honestly don't care who flies what airline. My comments were more on the business models. I hope that soon we are all complaining about how much we have to work and how short we are on pilots.
Look at the way SWA disrupted the industry post deregulation. That's exactly what the ULCCs are doing now. Fast forward a decade and you can bet there will be some consolidation and one or two strong players in the true ULCC game. Just like SWA has failed to compete head to head with legacy carriers doing legacy carrier stuff, so too will the ULCCs. Size and scale matter.
Now, a huge ULCC (700 plus aircraft) that is flush with cash? Yikes. That's something to be feared.
02-09-2021, 04:11 PM
#33
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,848
Originally Posted by e6bpilot
That must be a fun survey to do. Do you pass it out when you board and then collect them when you deplane?
Sorry I hurt your feelings. I honestly don't care who flies what airline. My comments were more on the business models. I hope that soon we are all complaining about how much we have to work and how short we are on pilots.
Look at the way SWA disrupted the industry post deregulation. That's exactly what the ULCCs are doing now. Fast forward a decade and you can bet there will be some consolidation and one or two strong players in the true ULCC game. Just like SWA has failed to compete head to head with legacy carriers doing legacy carrier stuff, so too will the ULCCs. Size and scale matter.
Now, a huge ULCC (700 plus aircraft) that is flush with cash? Yikes. That's something to be feared.
Sorry I hurt your feelings. I honestly don't care who flies what airline. My comments were more on the business models. I hope that soon we are all complaining about how much we have to work and how short we are on pilots.
Look at the way SWA disrupted the industry post deregulation. That's exactly what the ULCCs are doing now. Fast forward a decade and you can bet there will be some consolidation and one or two strong players in the true ULCC game. Just like SWA has failed to compete head to head with legacy carriers doing legacy carrier stuff, so too will the ULCCs. Size and scale matter.
Now, a huge ULCC (700 plus aircraft) that is flush with cash? Yikes. That's something to be feared.
Which has always kept me wondering why SWA didn't try to buy Spirit, or now. Sure seems easier to try to buy them or merge with them versus compete with them as Spirit grows.
Lacking a better analogy, sometimes its better to kill baby Hitler vs letting it grow up
02-09-2021, 05:01 PM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 261
Originally Posted by CincoDeMayo
Which has always kept me wondering why SWA didn't try to buy Spirit, or now. Sure seems easier to try to buy them or merge with them versus compete with them as Spirit grows.
Lacking a better analogy, sometimes its better to kill baby Hitler vs letting it grow up
Lacking a better analogy, sometimes its better to kill baby Hitler vs letting it grow up
At the time, the thinking was it was targeted at both Southwest and Delta as both would have a reason to merge Spirit into their operations.
02-09-2021, 05:03 PM
#35
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,848
Originally Posted by acecrackshot
There was a significant fear of a hostile takeover in early summer of 2020, which is why there were so many dilutive stock/poison pill measures were taken to make hostile takeover prohibitively expensive.
At the time, the thinking was it was targeted at both Southwest and Delta as both would have a reason to merge Spirit into their operations.
At the time, the thinking was it was targeted at both Southwest and Delta as both would have a reason to merge Spirit into their operations.
02-09-2021, 06:15 PM
#36
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: DOWNGRADE COMPLETE: Thanks Gary. Thanks SWAPA.
Posts: 6,615
Originally Posted by CincoDeMayo
Which has always kept me wondering why SWA didn't try to buy Spirit, or now. Sure seems easier to try to buy them or merge with them versus compete with them as Spirit grows.
Lacking a better analogy, sometimes its better to kill baby Hitler vs letting it grow up
Lacking a better analogy, sometimes its better to kill baby Hitler vs letting it grow up
02-10-2021, 05:42 AM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: Airplanes
Posts: 1,378
Originally Posted by e6bpilot
That must be a fun survey to do. Do you pass it out when you board and then collect them when you deplane?
Sorry I hurt your feelings.
Sorry I hurt your feelings.
You'll have to try much, much harder to hurt my feelings. My focus on this forum expires as soon as my coffee mug is empty.
02-10-2021, 05:48 AM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2013
Posts: 3,445
Originally Posted by Macjet
A survey? No, not at all. I'm just observant and talkative. If I'm in ORD and see shirts/hats/jackets from schools/businesses in WI/IN, or if I'm in DFW and see OK/AR gear, or in LAS and see UT/AZ then I start welcoming them and they usually just start spilling lots of information. Where they're from, why they're here, and where they're going. And one thing people will always voluntarily disclose is if they got a deal. My percentage guestimations are based solely on my observance of such. There may be more (not wearing such gear) or there may be less (they've never been to Wisconsin and just have the t-shirt).
You'll have to try much, much harder to hurt my feelings. My focus on this forum expires as soon as my coffee mug is empty.
You'll have to try much, much harder to hurt my feelings. My focus on this forum expires as soon as my coffee mug is empty.
And yet you continue.
02-10-2021, 07:08 AM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2015
Posts: 104
Every airline has passengers who are there because they “got a good deal”, “can’t stand XYZ airline”, etc. Also, every airline is the competition of every airline. That’s never going to change. At least now even the ULCC’s have good contracts that make them a very nice career destination. Rising tide and what not. Next 5 years will be interesting to watch.
02-10-2021, 09:49 AM
#40
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2014
Posts: 261
Originally Posted by e6bpilot
And yet you continue.
At this point, NK is at the point WN was in the 1980/1990s, as they build frequencies between pairings and build a stable network. The big differences are 1) the industry is far less fragmented, as most lift is on four carriers 2) NK looked at international travel far more early in the game than WN ever really did 3) NK doesn't have the advantages of an activist Congressional delegation and regulatory capture and 4) the WN network model was pretty innovative, where there is competition in both the network and LCC space now.
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