Income and schedule new pilots
11-30-2019, 12:18 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: to-go plate at hotel buffet
Posts: 802
Originally Posted by Shangri La
Correct which is why I said pre tax but with out knowing what state your in for effective tax rate, and other variables all you can reliably give to a stranger on the internet would be the gross numbers.
11-30-2019, 12:45 PM
#22
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2017
Posts: 32
Originally Posted by Balker
1. We lost flexibility with this contract. No dropping. Trade with other crew member yes.
2. We have a huge problem with PBS and reserve bidding. The system either honors the specific RAP you want or the days off you want. Not both. You would think the union would have found a solution around the system but no. On top of that, day offs bid can backfire for coverage award. If you don’t care which days off you get, you can prioritize the RAP.
3. RAPs depend on base and month. For example FLL has R3, R7, R10 and R19.
the number represents the starting time and ends 14hrs later. Last day of a block of RAP you could auto release 6 hrs prior if not used. R19 would give you more time off.
4. You could bid for a maximum of 6 RAPs in a row (5 for R19) and the min will be determined every month by crew planning. For example, min RAP block in FLL in Dec is 4.
5. Depending how you bid, you could get more than 4 days off in a row, but you’ll definitely will work the same number of RAPs.
6. No open time pickup on reserve. You can list on days off for x/y list but it’s hard to be legal.
7. After OE you get a relief line with all the privileges of a line holder. The first month you’re eligible to bid, you get what your seniority can hold, so... yeah reserve. No going back to consolidation.
8. Holding a line in ORD could take a while. Maybe 8-12 months. Maybe an ORD can chime in.
2. We have a huge problem with PBS and reserve bidding. The system either honors the specific RAP you want or the days off you want. Not both. You would think the union would have found a solution around the system but no. On top of that, day offs bid can backfire for coverage award. If you don’t care which days off you get, you can prioritize the RAP.
3. RAPs depend on base and month. For example FLL has R3, R7, R10 and R19.
the number represents the starting time and ends 14hrs later. Last day of a block of RAP you could auto release 6 hrs prior if not used. R19 would give you more time off.
4. You could bid for a maximum of 6 RAPs in a row (5 for R19) and the min will be determined every month by crew planning. For example, min RAP block in FLL in Dec is 4.
5. Depending how you bid, you could get more than 4 days off in a row, but you’ll definitely will work the same number of RAPs.
6. No open time pickup on reserve. You can list on days off for x/y list but it’s hard to be legal.
7. After OE you get a relief line with all the privileges of a line holder. The first month you’re eligible to bid, you get what your seniority can hold, so... yeah reserve. No going back to consolidation.
8. Holding a line in ORD could take a while. Maybe 8-12 months. Maybe an ORD can chime in.
#2. Reserve is a two step process. Days off, are the only thing considered via seniority. The RAP is then awarded based off your awarded days off.
#5. Unless you have a known absence (training, vacation, etc.) You will need 18 days of reserve EVERY month. How you fit that into the month, is up to your bidding strategy considering (the current) a min of 4 day blocks on call
#7. you'll only be awarded a Relief Line if youre released to the line, after 12:00ET on the 7th of (insert bid month here)
11-30-2019, 01:00 PM
#24
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by Balker
1. We lost flexibility with this contract. No dropping. Trade with other crew member yes.
2. We have a huge problem with PBS and reserve bidding. The system either honors the specific RAP you want or the days off you want. Not both. You would think the union would have found a solution around the system but no. On top of that, day offs bid can backfire for coverage award. If you don’t care which days off you get, you can prioritize the RAP.
2. We have a huge problem with PBS and reserve bidding. The system either honors the specific RAP you want or the days off you want. Not both. You would think the union would have found a solution around the system but no. On top of that, day offs bid can backfire for coverage award. If you don’t care which days off you get, you can prioritize the RAP.
By not bidding for days off you are not helping yourself. Ask the PBS guys.
But yes, I agree it sucks the way it currently works as days off and raps are not awarded together.
11-30-2019, 01:17 PM
#25
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2017
Position: I got a sick vendetta to get that chedda
Posts: 29
Originally Posted by Slowhawk
I’m no expert and these are rough numbers but about:
$1500 a month in training after tax
3700 a month first year after tax
7600 a month second year after tax
Line holders maybe 16 days off a month.
pilots in the schoolhouse are being awarded FLL and MCO before being released to the line right now
$1500 a month in training after tax
3700 a month first year after tax
7600 a month second year after tax
Line holders maybe 16 days off a month.
pilots in the schoolhouse are being awarded FLL and MCO before being released to the line right now
I’m currently on second year pay and live in California. I contribute 8% to the 401k and it’s the wife and I on my insurance. $7600 take home is way too high. If you bust your ass and are gone most the month, maybe. But to those seeing those numbers and getting excited, there’s no way they’re possible with 16 days off unless you had a few x/y trips.
11-30-2019, 02:48 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 531
People will argue about anything.
Anyone asking about pay now isn’t even hired yet and would be making like $109/hr+ 2nd year. I looked at the last bid packet and saw the average line was 80.75 hours. I assume someone getting hired during this hiring boom might have a line by year 2.
109 x 80.75 = 8,800.
8,800 x 0.80 (tax) (No state income tax in FL and single benefits plan)
=7,000.
Add about 400 per deim ( pEr DeIm iSnT iNcOmE)
=7,400.
The math doesn’t seem outlandish to me, but like I said:
Of course, if your situation is dramatically different than mine you can expect dramatically different pay 
naturally deducting an entire family’s benefits and paying $800 a month to live in California will yield a different pay
Anyone asking about pay now isn’t even hired yet and would be making like $109/hr+ 2nd year. I looked at the last bid packet and saw the average line was 80.75 hours. I assume someone getting hired during this hiring boom might have a line by year 2.
109 x 80.75 = 8,800.
8,800 x 0.80 (tax) (No state income tax in FL and single benefits plan)
=7,000.
Add about 400 per deim ( pEr DeIm iSnT iNcOmE)
=7,400.
The math doesn’t seem outlandish to me, but like I said:
I’m not an expert and those are rough numbers.
naturally deducting an entire family’s benefits and paying $800 a month to live in California will yield a different pay
11-30-2019, 03:06 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2013
Position: to-go plate at hotel buffet
Posts: 802
Ah gotcha all you gotta do is pay for zero benefits, pay less than the federal income tax, no FICA taxes, and add nothing to your retirement other than the company contribution and you’re all set.
11-30-2019, 03:12 PM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2011
Posts: 139
You cannot prioritize RAP over days off. By not selecting which days off you want you are simply allowing PBS to select them for you. THEN the system awards RAPs based on needs for the days you were awarded. It's a crapshoot for RAPs. Navblue in it's current state is completely incompatible with our reserve rules, I have questioned whether it is even contractually compliant. The union doesn't seem to care so I don't see anything changing.
11-30-2019, 03:22 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 439
17 days off in November and no calls for the X list or Y list. FO Based in Florida. Don’t ever count on premium trips to make ends meet! It’s nice when they call but there is zero guarantees. Plan on the base 72hrs on reserve or what ever your line value is.
