Please know who you are, you took a job at Spirit knowing that they are a true low cost carrier. Do you fly the same equipment as the Delta? Why, yes you do, and you do it very well and feel you should be paid the same as Delta, and Jet Blue. However, take a look at what your company is doing. I have watched customers loading on to a Spirit flight and without a doubt every time you have one to at least three people upset that they have to pay something extra to bring on some luggage that they would easily be able to take on to the others. You can't even give these poor folks a drink of water without charging them.

Look, you fly people on the cheap, and you do it well. This is the company you went to work for, and the fact that you want the same pay as Delta, JB, or even Alaska shows that you really haven't accepted where you work, the sooner that you do the sooner you can move forward. Or you can go work for one of those higher paying outfits that you so want to be. It is a free country, and nobody pushed you into this bed you are sleeping in. They are who we thought they were!! Take the reasonable pay raise, and in two years or so when the merger goes through you will get another pay raise. Please remember, you can put a dress on a Pig, but it is still a Pig. For those that are a bit slow the dress would be you the Pilots, and the Pig, that's who you work for. The reflection pool is open, take a look.

He may not have hit puberty yet. Total clown.

Who hurt you to make you think so little of yourself.

Another guy been in the industry for five minutes and came to spirit for a quick type and leave. Wants a quick raise bc he’ll be gone soon

Given the rate of attrition, there may be enough like him (and those already with CJOs elsewhere) to make the difference in the vote. But I certainly wouldn’t b|tch about these guys, the NK pilot group gets a lot more leverage from the attrition of trained guys then they do out of economically screwing over the new hires

^^^
Why is Bendo still posting on APC?

lol. we got an internet tough guy here.

You know, I have a 50% chance of being right about that guy right out of training, who was relentlessly trying to convince us all to accept a ****ty TA, planning on leaving as soon as he can.

I'm not even sure what got your panties in such a bunch tbh.

pathetic. It doesnt deserve a response, but I'll say this: Looking at flights home for Christmas, Spirit was the most expensive option out of many....3 months ago.

I call BS on your “reasonable pay raise”!We are more than on par with Alaska and JetBlue. I came here when there was only 50 airplanes so I know we’ve more than earned our place next to these airlines. Good bye Jyri!

Believe it or not, some pilots started at this company before it was a "ULCC". Ownership changes, management changes, they come in with big plans and ideas. Their job is to make money for the company and the shareholders, and they adapt whatever business plan they see fit, so long as it is profitable. My job as a pilot is to move the metal and pax safely and efficiently, plain and simple. I don't care what business model the company chooses to adopt this quarter, my job is still the same, and I expect to be compensated commensurate with my peers for doing that job. Southwest is still considered by some to be a "LCC", but you don't see that title being used against their pilots to manage their expectations. If SWA can pay their pilots well, and still make money, why can't Spirit? The only road to parity is to recognize your worth, and vote accordingly. If they can't afford to pay a standard wage, that's a management failure, not ours. How many contract cycles should it take to figure that out? I don't come to work to spend days away from my family to subsidize the company's success. Defer deliveries, park the 319s, I really don't GAF until they can figure out how to pay the pilots on property an industry-standard wage. Retention and talent acquisition are their problem, not mine.

BOOM! Mic drop!

Unbelievable the board allows these management clowns to run this place into the ground!

Lord help this JetBlue buyout to be approved!

Are you not doing the same, trying to shame people into saying no to the deal, that they’re voting yes because “they can’t pay their bills?” Kind of a cheap shot and a douchy thing to say. Fwiw, I think anyone pushing their own vote on others is stupid. Like I said, you wouldn’t (or should I say shouldn’t) say that to the guy sitting next to you. Conveying tone in text is difficult.

An oldie but a goodie.

Oh look everybody, a Narcissist!

Please remember, you can put a dress on when no one is watching, but you’re still a narcissist. And just in case you’re a bit slow, you are the pig.

So young and naive, guess you never heard of TED by United or Song by Delta.

It is ok, the truth hurts when you hear it for the first time. It gets easier from here. You have taken the first step, and I am proud of you. Now go find somebody to give you a hug, you need one.

Its DeltaD$%k2022 reincarnate. Go away little bee.

Careful everyone, lots of fake management shill accounts posting low value content on here (shortbusrider, johnbass, deltadouche, baseball23453464543, etc)

No pilot with any amount of self respect is going to try and persuade their peers in the industry to lower the bar, especially in this environment.

That's like having a house in a nice neighborhood and trying to talk your neighbor into painting their house bright pink and throwing an old rusted out Buick in the front yard. It's just not something people with a vested interest would do.

Sadly I believe this will now pass. It will be by a slim margin. Lots of turtling going on amongst the pilots in various group chats I’m a part of. Voting yes out of fear. We have such a weak pilot group. Battered pilot syndrome is a thing. I hope I’m wrong.

There are like at least a dozen reasons to turn this turd down but all yes voters can hang their hat on is ‘management might not come back to the table’. That’s some straight limp D energy.

Unfortunately, I feel you’re correct. This will be voted in out of fear.

I disagree. And to set the record straight, I reversed my feelings on this after the B6 TA got negotiated with a catch-up provision. I think that there is more that can be squeezed out this time even with a potential JCBA looming and now will be a ‘no’ vote because the JCBA can’t be depended upon before it actually passes DOJ muster. Now having said that, my no vote without a catch-up provision really is more about hedging the bet against DOJ disapproval than about believing this is a ‘turd’ because I think the NC actually did a pretty good job with the marching orders they were given, it’s just that the successes scored by B6 and DA have sort of changed the strategic outlook. I think we now have the ability to insist on a catch-up provision so we won’t be eternally trapped in lag by one contract cycle if the merger/acquisition falls through. It’ll also make us less attractive to Franke if that happens.

But other people are going to make other rational choices, some because they actually don’t plan on sticking around long enough to benefit. One can hardly expect someone who already has a legacy CJO and anticipates a class date 3 months out to vote to reenter negotiations rather than take a 1 Jan raise. Other people will make rational decisions to vote yes for other reasons. I’m now hoping the “No” voters prevail, but certainly don’t believe those who vote yes are weak or fearful or even uninformed. Some are just more comfortable with the proverbial “bird in hand…”. That’s not bad, just a different value judgment than mine.

It takes all kinds to make a world.

I feel the same way. Hoping for a “no”, but can’t fault those that vote yes. Not everyone has the same level of risk tolerance. To each their own.

This logic doesn’t add up. Keeping first year pay lower to bring everyone else up still isn’t industry standard. Attrition will also continue to be bad until newer peeps are offered a reason to stay. Being paid better than current contract rates.

I know you disagree, but I’ve never seen a more emotional group of people than the “no” voters in this forum

Compared to what exactly?

His very recent CFI job

Glad im not the only one. First time in a decade that I felt like I was back at the regionals. Between weak pilots and draconian management , B6 can't come fast enough.

Regular APC users lol

He obviously hasn't seen his company's financials.

Lol yeah, no

I'm curious, have you? My understanding is the people who have are under a nondisclosure.

This deal represents $463 million, if we are in such financial dire straits this deal would not have even come to light. The difference to bring us to parity with JB will not make a difference in the company's financial standing. This deal, in it's current form will do nothing to curb our attrition and entice prospective pilots to come here. I'm certain our attrition will greatly accelerate, and any prospective pilot looking to come here would be better served to join JB for both better SLI and higher pay right off the bat. The only pilots that will join are those that are unemployable elsewhere or those looking for the type to move on to a legacy. If this passes, we will continue to be a sinking ship, and if it doesn't, and management chooses not to engage we again continue to loose pilots and attract new one's which will add to our inefficiency and utilization of the current fleet.

Lol. I've seen what DAL reports as a publicly traded company. As an investor, I would look for other options. As a new hire union worker, I might be a little nervous. Of course, that goes for all participants in this sector.

My point wasn’t that first year pay shouldn’t go up. It should. I repeat: first year pay should increase.

What should not be held hostage for that to happen is contemporary industry pay rates.

Close your eyes and image for a moment we are not in a season of new pay rate defining TA’s. There hasn’t been double digit inflation and while things can always be better, we are fairly compensated in relation to our counterparts. Imagine NK pay scales on a color graph interwoven with those at the top, not riding down below under the “low cost” buffer. So there we are right in the mix, however our first year pay is still down at archaic subterranean levels, while every other major/legacies have it up much higher.

Now in this scenario, we can’t attract pilots, which means classes are empty, we can’t staff planes, grow bases, increase relative seniority, avoid meltdowns, etc etc.

In this scenario, if we were two years out from a contract and the company came to us for ONE TIME relief on first year pay in return for non-exciting raise that didn’t threaten to keep us below pay curve…. OK, I would say we have “secured our legacy” and now let’s make sure we can attract the talent we will need to grow this airline into what we know it can become.

But that’s not the world we live in. They want to get new guys in the door, get a few years of cheap labor from them and if they leave, they leave. Same with junior captains. Even in the road show it was said the company’s focused approach was attracting new hires, not pilot retention.

They want us to finance their pilot strategy of churning and burning, and I’m not going for it. I had a few libations the other night sure, but it’s not emotion.