For Real?
 

Giving up a JS to some junior puke because he needs to get to work?? :eek:

A stipend for SFO?? :D:D:

WOW. Where do peeps come up with this stuff? Obviously ain't happening. When's the next vacancy?

Oh it happens. Some of us aren’t in it just for me, if I can help out a fellow pilot.


Bid in 3.... 2.... 1....

"some junior puke"????? FOR REAL??? Thats how you look at your fellow pilots? its nice to know that you are so much better than someone junior to you... just call them scum! jeeeezz!

From my far away junior puke perch, it's actually worse than that. It's not "giving up the jumpseat". Its the Captain assigning the jumpseat to a specific pilot based upon his belief that a guys need to get to work outweighs whatever other reason another pilot may have for requesting the seat.

Absolutely, the JS belongs to the Captain. But adding a litmus test like this to see who gets it is nonsense. It will take about ten minutes before every request to ride will sound like this, "Hi Captain, this is my last shot to get to Houston for work. May I please ride your jumpseat?"

What's the next step? "OK, well I'll need to see your trip pairing because the other guy is going to work as well" Soon everyone will be going to work, their wedding or funeral and it will be the Captains job to determine merit and perceived rank. I'd guess that there are only a handful of guys out there who would like to add that responsibility to their workload.

A pilot of any seniority who voluntarily offers up his shot at the JS so that another guy can get to work is a nice guy and should be commended, especially if he is the more senior party. But the Captain assigning him to do so and abrogating seniority is out of bounds.

WRT to GUM, I don't know if the union decided that GUM pilots should get an extra stipend and then bargained for it, or the company offered it up out of need. I suspect that arrangement was in place prior to the merger, but I don't know. It seems like a fair and reasonable deal given the isolation and costs involved in living there. The SFO guys opining for the same are smoking weed.

And, "junior puke" is a term of endearment. Kind of like "junior maggot". They've been around for decades as well and are part of our wonderful hazing process.

Man, I guess that some of us really aren't in Kansas anymore.

Everyone of us was a junior puke at the beginning of our career. I got bumped out of the jumpseat many times by more senior guys, but I never whined that my reason for travelling was any more important than his. We have a "prudent pilot" policy here at United; if you choose to live out of base, plan your two flights accordingly and call the crew desk if you don't get on the second flight. Don't whine like a little [jet engine] if you get bumped and want to abrogate seniority.

Couldnt agree more. The 2nd jumpseat thread got a little sideways. We don't want to go down the rabbit hole of determining "need" for the jumpseat. This isn't atlas shrugged. Its a seniority thing.



Regarding GUM, that was in place when I got here. I imagine it was a way to get folks to bid it and keep it staffed. I don't imagine CAL getting as many pilot applications if all the newhires knew they were gonna end up on an island in the south Pacific. Who knows?! Certainly Guam is not a commutable base by any stretch of the imagination and that probably drove the decision to offer up a stipend.

What about my pony? I was told I would get a pony.

You did. It was served as a crew meal.

They have been tasting better lately.

Nor, I. Well said OM!

And that's today's winner. Thanks for playing everyone. See you tomorrow.

:p:p:p

Lunchlady Doris said during this scene: “more testicles means more iron!!” ������

Now is that the lighter choice pony or the regular pony? Asking for a friend.

Vacancy bids out :)

Revel in the victimhood culture and stand strong against microaggressions! The struggle is real!

I don't see why the SFO stipend is unreasonable unless the GUM stipend is also unreasonable. Is it?

FEDEX also has stipends for foreign domiciles. But not for US domiciles. Primarily for education, as in private schools. Guam would qualify. San Francisco would not. And yes, Guam is a US Territory. But it's not a state like California and at 4600 miles from the US mainland, not reasonably commutable. That's why it has it's own LOA, which btw exempts it from some of our work rules. A SFO stipend ain't gonna happen. But hey, its a forum, pontificate away. :)

What I’m hearing you say is that we need to eliminate foreign domiciles so that everyone is equal.

Only litmus test I have is did you ever cross a picket line. If so, adios. If not, welcome aboard!

As a non UAL pilot, serious question. Are there any other airlines other than United that use seniority to determine jumpseat priority?

I'll say that being able to list for a jumpseat and it's essentially a confirmed seat (FAA excepted) sure makes a massive difference in my QOL regardless of why I'm using it. I know there's a certain point where you probably never have anyone senior to you who shows up for it, but it really does make travel planning easier.

This must be a trick question.. Every airline that I know of uses seniority to set jumpseat priority.

Spirit is 72 hrs prior. First Spirit pilot to list gets priority. Seniority aside.

What happens if they no-show the listing?

It’s pretty easy write a script to automatically reserves the jumpseat at (available time + 1 second) just to have it as an option I suppose.

Delta doesn’t. They reserve it far in advance.

So the monthly schedule awards come out, and it is a food fight to see who has the fastest fingers to reserve jumpsuits? Or you reserve them before the awards, and then cancel them or just no show?

Unfortunately there needs to be a fair system. First come first served sounds like our current vacation passes. Instead of being used for what they were intended, they just become the "nuclear option" for pass travel, and everybody burns them to try to get a seat/better seat. And it still ends up going in DOH order.

As a new hire, I got bumped off lots of JS. But I always thought it was a fair system.

I'm interested in seeing the list of every airline you know of. United is alone among the big three and my understanding among all the legacies.

Delta is based on type of use for when you list (see below) and is confirmed upon listing.

AA just has a set timeframe that I think is a week prior regardless of reason.

IIRC Alaska is first come first serve but it's walkup only even for their own pilots.

I don't remember what SWA uses and any regionals I know actual policies of are first come first served.

For Delta there are three timeframes based on whether going to work, from work, or personal travel based on days prior to the flight in question, regardless of reason of use, once you list the jumpseat is yours.

Most commutes there's not a rush to reserve jumpseats when the window opens (I guess there could be some that go quickly but haven't experienced that) and since once you reserve it you have it confirmed you can plan commutes out well before the commute day itself. Because of this there is no list of pilots who enjoy showing up last minute to list and bump commuting pilots or stress about whether you are getting to work.

Regardless of what you think about seniority, the majority of the pilot group benefits from this system because everything is figured out well before the flight for planning purposes and you don't spend time waiting for a jumpseat you're not going to get when there are other options.

^^^this.

We have an archaic system that only benefits a few, but creates QOL issues for many.

SWA doesn't. It's first-come-first-served among SWA pilots as well as OAL. A SWA pilot can, of course, bump any OAL pilot, however, virtually all of us will happily take the 4th FA jumpseat if that's what it takes to get you on though.

I would gladly do that... but the AFA won’t let us ride “their” jumpseat.

Darn that seniority! It's wasted on those who have paid their way.
Viva the Bern!

Just to make it clear to me....

You're saying that the reason to keep the system is because people before have had to deal with it?

Deltas Jumpseat reservation system is a joke. People don’t show up and/or misconnect leaving it open as the aircraft departs with its Jumpseat empty. Only guys in here applauding this system are obviously deep on the south end of our list and want immediate gratification.

Of course when they finally do get some seniority you’ll hear all about how they paid their dues and how it sucks that just anyone can reserve the Jumpseat.

Jumpseat by seniority only. Delta can keep their reinvented wheel while we continue to do it properly.

You seriously think a DAL Captain would let a jumpseat go empty because the place holder no showed? Sorry other guy, but this seat is reserved, even if he didn’t show up. Really?

Everyone at UAL wants us to be Delta... contract, profit sharing, profitability, Airbus orders, etc. Right up until they don’t. It sucked for me it must suck for you!

“No one bought my beer as a new hire, why should I?”
Yes I heard that MANY times in EWR.

Properly? How about a junior guy getting a SC for the next day, reserving the JS for a completely full flight (no other JS'ers listed), leave for the airport at 5am for the first flight up to EWR, still no JS'ers listed... 5 minutes prior to walking down the jetbridge a senior pilot casually walks up to the gate and simply says "sorry, gotta take it, good luck." You're left scrambling, and running to Delta (as usual) to get to work. Is that proper? Giving no notice, just showing up and leaving someone to hang who thought they'd be getting on the JS? Happened several times actually.

Sure, seniority and all. I get it. But if we're going to argue what's proper, why don't you reserve the JS when you know you're going to try for that flight vs. walking up at the last minute.

I'm now at a place that allows JS reservations on a first come, first served basis 21 days out for a flight. No stress. I book when I know I need to get on that flight. Commuting is easy now.

I’m glad someone started this conversation. I always thought pretty much everyone operated the way UAL and Continental did in regards to the j/s. I would be in favor or changing it just to stop the senior scabs showing up at last minute without listing.

Not at all what I'm saying Grumble. I'm talking about guys like you or me who see that the Jumpseat is previously reserved and don't bother showing up because its RESERVED. Said reservee no shows, (and my buddies at DAL says this happens often), and the Jumpseat goes out empty.

No one bought me anything at CAL when I was new yet I continue to buy for both 1/2 wingers and non ones. Not looking for accolades but know your audience.

weird, i don't know a single person here that wants to get rid of the way our JS system works.....we certainly don't want to go to the way United's is.

Completely agree with you about listing. No-showing at the last minute is lame, but again, sh!t happens. Your inbound flight was late and you missed your original flight perhaps? The reservation system works and guys mostly know who and when the seat will be occupied. Reserving it is a fastest fingers, non-seniority honoring lousy way of doing it. I don't commute and still think its wrong.

Strangely almost every Delta guy I know says the polar opposite. Guessing you're within the bottom third of the seniority list?

There’s a simple fix for that. If you no show a Fedex jumpseat once you get warned, twice and you’re banned (as an offline guy, not sure about their own).