Originally Posted by UALinIAH (Post 2790077)

DAL is hiring........

It’s silly because if you die early you left a hell of a lot more than you planned to leave your heirs.

Worst case you leave your heirs multiple millions in your B fund that the 16% provided and the extra over $265k into your VEBA to your union brothers and sisters because you were so fortunate ebough to be a WB CA for longer than the average person hired.

Heaven forbid your windfall help out your ALPA brothers and sisters because you and your dependents in your family had an untimely death. I am glad I don’t fly with independent contractors like you.

Nice tie.

Originally Posted by Jay1122 (Post 2791119)

Sounds like you have a Bernie Sanders rally to attend. This is one of the quintessential social-liberalist arguments: "You had better circumstances in life so you owe me some of your largess."



This is the fundamental problem with liberal socialism, everyone loves it when they get the free ****, everyone hates it when they realize they have to pay for everyone else's free ****. Historically, labor unions have always been closely linked to socially leftist politics, it's just that we rationalize differently when it benefits us.

Originally Posted by ualPHLier (Post 2791079)

Long time lurker here, but I feel the need to address this comment, since I believe it's inaccurate.

VEBA is not the only free-in/free-grow/free-withdraw retirement vehicle, particularly as it relates to health care expenses. Health savings accounts (HSA's) garner this triple benefit too, with some additional advantages to the VEBA structure:
1. Contributions, earnings, and withdrawals (if they're for qualified health expenses for yourself, your spouse, or your dependents) are all tax-free.
2. Once you reach retirement age, any balance in your HSA may continue to be withdrawn tax-free for health related expenses; or, you may choose to make withdrawals as taxable income in retirement and use it for whatever you want (no IRS penalties, just your then-current income tax).
3. The account is in your name, managed by you for investment growth, can be passed to whomever you choose, etc.

If a married couple starts contributing to an HSA this year, up to the current IRS limit of $7000 for a family, continues to do so for 15 years (assuming no increase in the $7k limit), and earns a modest 4% average return, they would have over $140k in the account by the end of those 15 years. Stretch it to 30 years and they'd have $400k; increase the projected growth rate and the number is obviously even higher.

My point is simply to provide another example illustrating that not everyone's situation and choices will follow the same path. If there is an IRS-compliant VEBA structure that affords pilots the ability to take their "excess" DC contributions as taxable income (while continuing to make their $1/hr mandatory VEBA contributions), then I wholeheartedly favor giving the group that option. If I'm missing something please feel free to enlighten me.

Originally Posted by El10 (Post 2791545)

Don’t plans that offer an HSA have high deductibles?

Originally Posted by ReadyRsv (Post 2791585)

Yes. Most people do not have these plans.

VEBA is a good plan for the majority of pilots when you look at IRS rules and limitations.

Originally Posted by ualPHLier (Post 2792102)

I'd be interested to read the source info on what the IRS requires in order to retain tax-advantaged status. The Q&A document posted earlier mentions a requirement that all pilots participate in the plan, but, unless I missed it, it doesn't define participation.

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Originally Posted by ualPHLier (Post 2792102)

Deductible is $2500 individual/$5000 family. The company puts $800 (or $1600 for family) directly into the HSA as wellness incentive. If the unforeseen occurs and I have to pay $5000 out of pocket in a given year, that's why we have an emergency fund. (Plus, under current law, I could pay that $5k that I incurred this year using after-tax, non-HSA money, and then decide 20 years later that I wanted to reimburse myself from the HSA. Still legal, no time limit on taking the HSA withdrawal.) Not trying to cause a thread drift into the merits of any particular health plan over any other; just reiterating the point that we all make different choices in this realm.

My issue with the VEBA structure, as has been stated earlier in the thread, is that it currently does not afford us a choice. Require us all to make our $1/hr contributions, I have no issue with that. But give us a choice over whether to push additional income into it. If that system, or some version of it, is IRS compliant, then I fail to see what the downside is to the group as a whole.

I'd be interested to read the source info on what the IRS requires in order to retain tax-advantaged status. The Q&A document posted earlier mentions a requirement that all pilots participate in the plan, but, unless I missed it, it doesn't define participation.

I agree, the RHA is a great tool, and the ability to maximize it's growth is a great benefit. We should also have the option to minimize it, if we so choose.

Originally Posted by ReadyRsv (Post 2792378)

Your idea would be great, if legal. The company and ALPA can’t control the limitations imposed by the IRS.