Itsajob

I’ve never experienced an endless brief on several fleets and in several bases. Even on widebody flights it’s a quick in and out unless something is really messed up. We all look at the paperwork independently and then speak up if something needs addressed. Captain calls dispatch, someone gets to color on a chart, then it’s off for coffee and to the plane to get it ready at a very leisurely pace. On the 737 it was a quick question as to if I saw any weather, notam, or MEL issues, followed by asking if I was comfortable with the fuel. Not exactly endless.

Not going to start up that old legacy this/that mess. The FOM now says that you should meet and they go on to define what “should” means. The grey area has been removed. Kind of like the hat. I may think that it serves little purpose, but if the book says wear the hat, I wear the hat.

Hatesheavys

Nope, CRM has nothing to do with what room you meet in, and nothing to do with giving a BS debrief after every leg you fly either....

Hilltopper89

I live in Doylestown. Other than Solebury schools (near New Hope) Central Bucks schools can’t be beaten. You’re gonna pay a lot more for a house in Doylestown than Easton, Nazareth, or Allentown, and even more than that in Solebury.


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detpilot

Except that, it kinda does. But I'm sure you're smarter than those idiots who wrote the books. Right?

Davedave

That’s cool that you fly perfect sorties every day. Curious, did yuh self submit your nomination to the Aviation Hall Of Fame?

Are you right next to Bob Hoover? Pro tip: you’re only cool breaking the United Airlines FOM when you’re behind your keyboard Mr Warrior.

Davedave

To new hires: Welcome aboard. You’ll love it. EWR and IAD are both great bases. Pick the one that you want to live near and never look back about coulda woulda shoulda.

P.S. 99% of pilots are great to fly with. You only fly with Aviation Hall of Famers like above once in a while. Annoying bit it’s only a couple of days. Then back to the test of the good dudes.

Halfwings don’t pay for alcohol for a full year.

okieskies99

Most of the time could care less, but I prefer to meet at the jet, make sure the temp is right, and start heading off any issues that might pop up. There's plenty of time to ask the other guy at length about his wife, kids, and background at cruise. Asking about fuel and the MEL is almost always a quick discussion, and if we really don't want to be bothered to discuss something or do a basic intro, we can always close the doors for a minute.

I believe SWA and Delta don't meet at OPS/FPA's. I think they have CRM at those airlines. Some base/fleet combos at United meet in ops rarely. I don't think they all consider themselves perfect. How is not meeting in ops making the claim to be a perfect aviator? The meeting place is not CRM. The FOM does define should, but standards decided to make a should instead a must or shall. Plenty of guys that meet in ops in the summer with a hat on have horrible CRM, and plenty of guys that meet at the jet have great CRM and set a great tone right off the bat, and vice versa.

An honest compelling reason (referenced under "should")...80% of the time we meet in ops in some fleets, by the time we get to the jet we have passengers on a plane that is way too hot. Calling in missing catering items at some hubs takes forever. That's not disregarding violating the FOM, and I'm interested in how it's not Capt's authority to contact the FO to see if they'd like to meet at the jet.

Nothing a Captain says in ops that can't be said at the jet is going to drastically change the way an FO does his or her job.

I assume the point he was making (since he was replying to someone who will be new) is that some Capts like to meet in ops, take a long time briefing or doing the canned "tell me about your family" and then get their new hire FO to the jet with 20-30 minutes left (with passengers sitting in a hot jet). Many of those guys will also not offer to do the walk around, and when the FA's need anything, add the calls to ops to the FO's list of things to do while they play solitaire. Has the FO been off for a long time, or are they new? Disregarding how much time an FO might need to take on preflight is actually bad CRM.

Itsajob

I agree. Every airline crew has the same discussion before every flight. Most airlines do it at the plane. Our company seems to think that having that same discussion in a remote location, but only for the first flight of a pairing, makes a difference. Personally I think that it serves no purpose. The content of the brief is important, not the location. Regardless of how I feel, as long as the FOM says to go to a weather room for the first flight of a trip, I’ll go have the brief there and then go to the plane. All I care about is that both pilots are on the same page.

N6279P

Agree with all of this. One of my favorite things is when the captain tries to figure out my entire life story after meeting me 30 seconds ago.

Bpcrate

It’s not the company. It’s lual’s archaic practices that keep this alive. Company just pushes out what our union asks for with this one.



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