Originally Posted by pangolin

Yeah until you get to the point where you need someone to make an instinctual decision but the automation cannot do it. After the third go around for unstable conditions and the fuel is about to run out and this landing must be made - who do you want doing it? Me or George?

I can’t count the times I’ve climbed above plan or slowed to requested shortcuts to conserve fuel that I ended up needing because of Atc or wx delays. I can SEE a building cell and avoid it as nothing yet is showing on the radar. Etc.

Originally Posted by Setopbug

My airplane's crosswind limit is 25 knots. My limit is 45 knots.

It's going to be decades, and will require a clean sheet aircraft and systems architecture design, and a complete change in how the NAS is run. And you've probably seen how quickly the FAA embraces, procures and refines new technology.

Optical sensors are improving? LOL. The USAF can't deliver a FMC refueler based on existing airframe technology after two decades.

Relax. Your concern should be how you're going to keep from having to spend your life savings on medical care. Nearest, hottest threat, buddy.

Originally Posted by flightmedic01

’Bus does the same thing.

Originally Posted by flightmedic01

’Bus does the same thing.

Originally Posted by Viperstick

While we ruminate about something (HAL taking our place) that is years, probably decades away at least, I think we're missing the big picture.

The title of this thread is "Pilot Shortage." Demand for our services was extremely high and accelerating seven months ago. That drove the pay improvements all carriers saw through the '10s. This black swan event is unprecedented, but like all black swan events, it will eventually pass. When it does and there is again accelerating demand for our services, where are the pilots going to come from? The military has been producing far less pilots than it used to and at least the Air Force still has a serious rated manning shortage. Civilian production has been decimated by the lost decade and the attendant aversion to the high cost and low return on investment prospective pilots faced, hence programs like Aviate to try to prime the pump. After this event, it may again be a hard sell to a college age American to consider a career in aviation. But the fact remains, we are difficult to produce widgets--there's a long lead time and considerable expense to do so. You can't just magically produce an ATP qualified individual overnight.

Originally Posted by tallpilot

With all due respect, every head in the sand 'automation ain't taking my job' argument assumes that if the computer can't figure it out the airplane just runs out of fuel and crashes. These flights will be constantly monitored from the SoC and there will be multiple ways to upload changes including taking over full control manually.

Do you think it might occur to them to put a video camera on the nose to 'see' that building cumulus you mentioned? Optical sensors keep improving and so do the algorithms used to analyze the data. I don't mean to be insulting but it is truly inconceivable to you that engineers can't figure out how to get a computer to steer around a cloud??

First we will fly these things single pilot to monitor the automation to see how it does. Then we'll move to being on standby in the SoC to take over manual control, then they will figure out they don't need 'real' pilots for that.

I know nobody wants to think of the day the skills we've spent a lifetime perfecting are nearly worthless but ignoring trends and pretending it won't happen is irrational. The only question is can we make it to retirement before it does.

Originally Posted by captive apple

I think the first two posters of false loc are CRJ pilots. False loc capture is a CRJ Rockwell Collins 4200 issue and not at ground based issue.

Originally Posted by captive apple

I think the first two posters of false loc are CRJ pilots. False loc capture is a CRJ Rockwell Collins 4200 issue and not at ground based issue.

Originally Posted by Andy

We can all fly 'til we die.