kcdriver

Can you elaborate on "riskier career?" I have CJOs from UA and WN (30 y/o) and plan on moving to the DC area (live in-base for either). I am leaning toward WN primarily for the reason that I do not think UA's 500+ aircraft on order will be friendly to its balance sheet. If/when the next pandemic/worldwide calamity rolls around, I think that WN will be best insulated and prepared among the big 4 passenger airlines in the US. Is a single fleet type and lengthier upgrade worth the trade-off for perceived corporate stability? I don't know.

Shimmyshimmy03

Great input from everybody. It’s nice hearing a lot of the same reasons that I have built mentally, I just needed to make sure I wasn’t missing something as an outsider looking in.

WHACKMASTER

Do not underestimate what being stuck in the Guppy for decades (the MAXes are new and will have a 20-25 year lifespan at SWA) and flying on average three legs a day will do to your enjoyment of the job.

Let me be frank, after 16.5 years on the damn thing, I’m thoroughly over it and especially thoroughly over the SWA flying.

I can’t believe this is even a question in people’s minds. 🤦‍♂️

jumppilot

Totally. I was telling my FO last trip (I’m a 737 CA) that if we were at SW you’d better get used to it, as that’d be your career.

I’m downgrading to 787 FO in October because I only want one leg a day with long overnights. Maybe I’ll come back as a 737 CA or maybe I’ll just wait it out and upgrade on the WB.

Options and variety are good. Flying the 737 for a career would give me mental problems.

serce

While I gree with your logic let's not forget that United has the worst reserve rules of any major and probably one of the worst work rules as well. The nature of widebody flying is United's saving grace. Otherwise, if you don't see yourself flying on the global fleet, SW is the better choice in my opinion.

FriendlyPilot

“Riskier career?”

United may have $42B in debt and lease obligations, but it has over $70B in gross assets, including over $18B cash on hand. Also United has generated over $3B in net cash flow in Q1 and Q2 of 2022. United is in a very strong position for an airline. Far more net equity than almost every other airline. United also announced they will be using cash to pay for the planes going forward using its strong cash flow. You can be a 737 Captain as soon as you get 1 year on the property and 500 hours. Or you can be a 777 or 787 FO as a new hire. United isn’t going anywhere, its part of an oligopoly, and except for Covid, its has been profitable every year since 2009.

Also this is the strongest management team we have had in the last 30 years. Whatever happened in the past (furloughs from 9/11 and the 2008 Financial crisis) is the past. Any pilot hired today will likely have 8,000 pilots junior to them by 2028.

Otterbox

UA under Kirby is trying to grow, a lot. Both Domestically, and internationally There’s risk in that. SWA is content to grow domestically at ~2% a year, with the same aircraft.

UA has a history of hiring till furlough until recently, and SWA had a history of trying to not furlough until recently.

If you’re 30 now at UA there’s a chance you’ll be a 737 Captain in DC probably by the time you’re 35 and have taken a spin on the 320, 756 and 787 along the way. If you’re 30 now at SWA you might be a Captain around the time you turn 45 in BWI. You’ll have 15-17 days off the whole time until then and after flying 4 legs a day.

You’ve got a 35 year career… If you’re within driving distance to the DC area airports, I’d probably go to UA over SWA. 2/3 of the folks I know in similar position recently have. No one has regretted the one they picked though. Good problem to have.

at6d

It’s still hard to fathom the enormity of opportunity for folks applying in this day. Must be stressful applying to everyone, and getting calls from everyone! Amazing how the game has changed in such a short time.

GPullR

Worst work rules?? You are clueless.

01110011

How many other majors can roll you into your day off an unlimited amount of times?

how many other majors only give you only 6 hard days off on reserve?

How many other majors can arbitrarily increase the number of reserves and required reserves, taking away lines and making it impossible to drop a single trip?

Hotel language is good. Soft pay is pretty good. Crew meals/ground transportation/hotel walk ability is good.

Days off/day off protection is abysmal and frankly no amount of add pay makes up for having plans on my day off robbed for company convenience. We have a ton of awesome little things for events that either rarely happen (hotel walks) or aren’t really worth a ton of money (dry cleaning), but we have very poor protections for our schedule and for our home lives.

I told a friend at delta about global reserve and they looked at me like I was insane. Then I told them about how you can get reassigned until 11:59 on a day off even if the company can get you back to base and I thought their head was going to explode. There is no reason getting an EDCT on your last day, misconnecting for your final turn, should allow the company to pull you off your last turn and assign you an overnight.

I shouldn’t have to bid for an extra day off before my plans just in case the company decides that their inability to staff is my problem and they decide to rob my day off so I can cover an inefficient PIT overnight for an extra 5 hours of pay.