United MBCBP details
09-04-2023 | 05:33 AM
#11
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OK, fair. But certainly more on our terms then the RHA. Namely that it can be rolled over to an IRA (hopefully at 59 1/2) and it’s in my estate forever, whether I use it or pass it along, unlike the RHA.
09-04-2023 | 05:39 AM
#12
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At least in the current language, that’s in there, but it’s all pretty broad brush stuff until approved. On a somewhat related note, for those of us on Tricare, don’t forget that you are going to have to start Medicare at 65. In today’s dollars, that’s around $5k/yr.
09-04-2023 | 06:20 AM
#13
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True, I think the RHA should have a place for most of us, Tricare or not. Long term care insurance premiums alone will be a mint so there’s room for both RHA and MBCBP.
09-04-2023 | 06:51 AM
#14
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From: guppy CA
Medicare Part A has no cost unless you have less than 40 quarters (10 years) of paying Medicare taxes. This applies to very few people so I won't go further on this.
Medicare Part B has a monthly cost based on your income two years prior. IE: 2024 Part B premiums are based on 2022 income.
Chart of monthly cost: https://www.retiremed.com/medicare-part-b
The premiums (Medicare Part A and B) can be paid with RHA money.
I have close to $200K in my RHA and expect to go through all of that in retirement but am no longer wanting any spillage into my RHA. I will get an MBCBP so that I can eventually sweep that money into my IRA when I am permitted.
09-04-2023 | 07:02 AM
#15
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From: 767/757 CA
To add a bit of detail for those who go to Tricare for Life (Tricare after reaching age 65), you must enroll in Medicare Part A and Part B.
Medicare Part A has no cost unless you have less than 40 quarters (10 years) of paying Medicare taxes. This applies to very few people so I won't go further on this.
Medicare Part B has a monthly cost based on your income two years prior. IE: 2024 Part B premiums are based on 2022 income.
Chart of monthly cost: https://www.retiremed.com/medicare-part-b
The premiums (Medicare Part A and B) can be paid with RHA money.
I have close to $200K in my RHA and expect to go through all of that in retirement but am no longer wanting any spillage into my RHA. I will get an MBCBP so that I can eventually sweep that money into my IRA when I am permitted.
Medicare Part A has no cost unless you have less than 40 quarters (10 years) of paying Medicare taxes. This applies to very few people so I won't go further on this.
Medicare Part B has a monthly cost based on your income two years prior. IE: 2024 Part B premiums are based on 2022 income.
Chart of monthly cost: https://www.retiremed.com/medicare-part-b
The premiums (Medicare Part A and B) can be paid with RHA money.
I have close to $200K in my RHA and expect to go through all of that in retirement but am no longer wanting any spillage into my RHA. I will get an MBCBP so that I can eventually sweep that money into my IRA when I am permitted.
09-04-2023 | 07:06 AM
#16
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I need the data to determine whether it’s a flop.
If you look at an entire investment portfolio holistically, a MBCBP with a relatively conservative strategy can be balanced with a 401k or IRA with a more aggressive one, with big tax savings. It’s all getting rolled into an IRA anyway.
As far as the RHA goes, each of us has a different opinion on that. Personally I know I’ll have probably $100k+ of medical expenses for myself and my wife, even with Tricare, so it’s part of my long term financial plan.
If you look at an entire investment portfolio holistically, a MBCBP with a relatively conservative strategy can be balanced with a 401k or IRA with a more aggressive one, with big tax savings. It’s all getting rolled into an IRA anyway.
As far as the RHA goes, each of us has a different opinion on that. Personally I know I’ll have probably $100k+ of medical expenses for myself and my wife, even with Tricare, so it’s part of my long term financial plan.
09-04-2023 | 07:26 AM
#17
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From: guppy CA
Heck, if you live in a 2 story house and can't do stairs anymore, RHA will pay for an elevator.
And Tricare copays will continue to rise along with needing to pay more copays as we age.
09-04-2023 | 08:56 AM
#18
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Long term care insurance policy is fairly expensive. Just for a couple of data points on a LTC policy.
At age 74 the policy was about $7200/year with a max lifetime benefit of $297,500 and 5 year max.
At age 92 the policy was about $8,000/year with a Max lifetime benefit $328,000. The monthly pay reimbursement was about $5,000/month. The facility charged $7,400 month. Was in the facility about 12 months
Started as assisted living and progressed to memory care. One never knows what the future will bring. In this case, the policy premiums far surpassed what was paid out and was a "bad investment"
Insurance is always a gamble. You are betting things are going to be bad, the insurance company bets things are going to be good.
At age 74 the policy was about $7200/year with a max lifetime benefit of $297,500 and 5 year max.
At age 92 the policy was about $8,000/year with a Max lifetime benefit $328,000. The monthly pay reimbursement was about $5,000/month. The facility charged $7,400 month. Was in the facility about 12 months
Started as assisted living and progressed to memory care. One never knows what the future will bring. In this case, the policy premiums far surpassed what was paid out and was a "bad investment"
Insurance is always a gamble. You are betting things are going to be bad, the insurance company bets things are going to be good.
09-04-2023 | 11:06 AM
#19
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Joined: Jun 2015
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Long term care insurance policy is fairly expensive. Just for a couple of data points on a LTC policy.
At age 74 the policy was about $7200/year with a max lifetime benefit of $297,500 and 5 year max.
At age 92 the policy was about $8,000/year with a Max lifetime benefit $328,000. The monthly pay reimbursement was about $5,000/month. The facility charged $7,400 month. Was in the facility about 12 months
Started as assisted living and progressed to memory care. One never knows what the future will bring. In this case, the policy premiums far surpassed what was paid out and was a "bad investment"
Insurance is always a gamble. You are betting things are going to be bad, the insurance company bets things are going to be good.
At age 74 the policy was about $7200/year with a max lifetime benefit of $297,500 and 5 year max.
At age 92 the policy was about $8,000/year with a Max lifetime benefit $328,000. The monthly pay reimbursement was about $5,000/month. The facility charged $7,400 month. Was in the facility about 12 months
Started as assisted living and progressed to memory care. One never knows what the future will bring. In this case, the policy premiums far surpassed what was paid out and was a "bad investment"
Insurance is always a gamble. You are betting things are going to be bad, the insurance company bets things are going to be good.
Back in the 80s, long term care was a moderate expense, but not super, catastrophically expensive. A couple of insurance companies thought "hey, people need long term care, they usually only live to XX, here is the expected pay out, and we can make money off of that." But as is typical, once insurance got involved, that generated a whole secondary market for people looking to grab their money. All of a sudden, you had a bunch of new, expensive long term care facilities and providers (didn't say anything about nice or livable), and, no surprise, costs went right to the limits of the policies. The facilities that had been around said "well, we're leaving money on the table", so everyone jacked the prices up to match. That the secondary effect of wiping out the people were just going along and paying out of pocket.
In the meantime, several underwriters who had based their entire data set on such and such costs for XX amount of time, and were offering essentially lifetime benefits if you paid into the plan for 10-15-20 years, got completely wiped out. It put a couple underwriters into the dirt, and the rest had to go to the regulators and drastically retrench their benefit portfolios. It really hammered people who had been policy holders for years, because the retrenched benefits (with $ and time limits) were a fraction of what they had signed up for, and paid into.
Like most things insurance related, there is a huge market for jacking things up that aren't directly related to insuring, paying benefits or providing services. The insurance companies, no surprise, go into pure defense mode, and trying to get any money out of them is a exercise in colossal frustration. THAT has led to yet another market of for people who's so job is to extract money from insurance for people with legitimate claims. As a bonus, if you're uninsured, you have to pay the jacked up insured rate.
09-04-2023 | 11:33 AM
#20
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,213
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From: guppy CA
Long term care insurance was one of those things that seemed like a good idea, but got overtaken by the normal "fleece insurance companies for all they have". Don't get me wrong, I have zero love for any insurance companies, but this is an example of how OPM makes life difficult for everyone.
Back in the 80s, long term care was a moderate expense, but not super, catastrophically expensive. A couple of insurance companies thought "hey, people need long term care, they usually only live to XX, here is the expected pay out, and we can make money off of that." But as is typical, once insurance got involved, that generated a whole secondary market for people looking to grab their money. All of a sudden, you had a bunch of new, expensive long term care facilities and providers (didn't say anything about nice or livable), and, no surprise, costs went right to the limits of the policies. The facilities that had been around said "well, we're leaving money on the table", so everyone jacked the prices up to match. That the secondary effect of wiping out the people were just going along and paying out of pocket.
In the meantime, several underwriters who had based their entire data set on such and such costs for XX amount of time, and were offering essentially lifetime benefits if you paid into the plan for 10-15-20 years, got completely wiped out. It put a couple underwriters into the dirt, and the rest had to go to the regulators and drastically retrench their benefit portfolios. It really hammered people who had been policy holders for years, because the retrenched benefits (with $ and time limits) were a fraction of what they had signed up for, and paid into.
Like most things insurance related, there is a huge market for jacking things up that aren't directly related to insuring, paying benefits or providing services. The insurance companies, no surprise, go into pure defense mode, and trying to get any money out of them is a exercise in colossal frustration. THAT has led to yet another market of for people who's so job is to extract money from insurance for people with legitimate claims. As a bonus, if you're uninsured, you have to pay the jacked up insured rate.
Back in the 80s, long term care was a moderate expense, but not super, catastrophically expensive. A couple of insurance companies thought "hey, people need long term care, they usually only live to XX, here is the expected pay out, and we can make money off of that." But as is typical, once insurance got involved, that generated a whole secondary market for people looking to grab their money. All of a sudden, you had a bunch of new, expensive long term care facilities and providers (didn't say anything about nice or livable), and, no surprise, costs went right to the limits of the policies. The facilities that had been around said "well, we're leaving money on the table", so everyone jacked the prices up to match. That the secondary effect of wiping out the people were just going along and paying out of pocket.
In the meantime, several underwriters who had based their entire data set on such and such costs for XX amount of time, and were offering essentially lifetime benefits if you paid into the plan for 10-15-20 years, got completely wiped out. It put a couple underwriters into the dirt, and the rest had to go to the regulators and drastically retrench their benefit portfolios. It really hammered people who had been policy holders for years, because the retrenched benefits (with $ and time limits) were a fraction of what they had signed up for, and paid into.
Like most things insurance related, there is a huge market for jacking things up that aren't directly related to insuring, paying benefits or providing services. The insurance companies, no surprise, go into pure defense mode, and trying to get any money out of them is a exercise in colossal frustration. THAT has led to yet another market of for people who's so job is to extract money from insurance for people with legitimate claims. As a bonus, if you're uninsured, you have to pay the jacked up insured rate.
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