New rumblings from the L-UAL side???
#1
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Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2008
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So big FWIW but there has been increased "chatter" lately that things are looking a little more active on the L-UAL side regarding manpower. From bits and pieces on various forums and emails it seems more than a few are claiming the manpower landscape is becoming a little less greener over there and plans for recalls after the summer are becoming much more of a reality.
Hmmmmph, we shall see.
Color me skeptical....
So the latest making the rounds (get out your salt rock and chisel):
-L-UAL manpower looking quite a bit thinner than previous summers with traffic stronger than expected.
-More instructors being spooled up at TK which will draw manpower to get things revved up by fall.
-A increasing concern that those who just signed up for the L-CAL reserve party train will (aaaah, yeah???) jump ship to L-UAL and do another tango through the TK schoolhouse, thereby inviting even more folk to Houston beyond the current 165 vacancies.
-Leave extensions deep sixed and apparently more than a few LOA's who were due to come back have quit. Also rumors there has been an uptick in folks "medicalling out" due to various health conditions.
Hmmmmph, we shall see.

Color me skeptical....
So the latest making the rounds (get out your salt rock and chisel):
-L-UAL manpower looking quite a bit thinner than previous summers with traffic stronger than expected.
-More instructors being spooled up at TK which will draw manpower to get things revved up by fall.
-A increasing concern that those who just signed up for the L-CAL reserve party train will (aaaah, yeah???) jump ship to L-UAL and do another tango through the TK schoolhouse, thereby inviting even more folk to Houston beyond the current 165 vacancies.
-Leave extensions deep sixed and apparently more than a few LOA's who were due to come back have quit. Also rumors there has been an uptick in folks "medicalling out" due to various health conditions.
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Sep 2007
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1. i havent heard of any increased instructoring going on at ual TK.
2. the union will negotiate away the pilot group's leverage for the ual pilots already at cal to avoid the double training-- i guarantee it
3. ual is/was currently requesting leaves of absences ( at least for march they were)
4. they will adapt to decreased manning by parking old 757s
5. no hiring off street this year bc pilots will want to be on property for the signed contract "bonuses" by 2013, thereby countering the bypass rate bc it wont get to the junior furloughees
6. pathetic unity displayed on both sides
7. childish games being played by both sides
8. the new ual is a joke until they get the required items lost and improved upon from bankruptcy--- 10 years is a long time for our livelyhood to continue to be eroded
just my opinion
2. the union will negotiate away the pilot group's leverage for the ual pilots already at cal to avoid the double training-- i guarantee it
3. ual is/was currently requesting leaves of absences ( at least for march they were)
4. they will adapt to decreased manning by parking old 757s
5. no hiring off street this year bc pilots will want to be on property for the signed contract "bonuses" by 2013, thereby countering the bypass rate bc it wont get to the junior furloughees
6. pathetic unity displayed on both sides
7. childish games being played by both sides
8. the new ual is a joke until they get the required items lost and improved upon from bankruptcy--- 10 years is a long time for our livelyhood to continue to be eroded
just my opinion
#5
3. ual is/was currently requesting leaves of absences ( at least for march they were)
Besides this changes everything.
April 14, 2012
Dear United Pilots:
Many of you have heard or used the term “release” while our Railway Labor Act (RLA) Section 6 negotiations have been in mediation for quite some time. I would like to explain this term and how it may factor into our future. Perhaps the most important item to understand is what release is not; it is not a release from the status quo or our obligations under the injunction. Neither the company nor employees are free to engage in self-help when first “released.”
While negotiating under the Railway Labor Act (RLA), either party may request to be released from mediated negotiations. If the National Mediation Board (NMB) agrees, it will proffer arbitration and if, after 10 days both parties do not agree, then an impasse would be declared and a 30-day “cooling off” period would begin.
The term “cooling off” is a misnomer; your union, the NMB and certainly management would all be extremely busy during this 30-day countdown. The parties should then be committed to negotiating the JCBA if they are truly serious about its completion – more so than hitherto. This would be the beginning of the end-game to bargain under the RLA. While the RLA was written to protect the flow of commerce, the risk of interruption of that flow is finally a legal point of leverage.
ALPA National, and by extension our MEC, has a vast array of tools at their disposal to assist local Councils and our pilots. Technology is helpful, but the determining factor in any release scenario is the dedication of the individual pilot and his/her desire for a successful outcome.
There is a generic strike handbook published by ALPA. I tasked our SPSC to work with our counterparts at CAL SPSC to create and publish a “Joint United and Continental Strike Preparedness Manual 2012.” This will be our reference manual for training and job assignments. It is very explicit, technical and accurate. It is ready.
I, the MEC, and its Officers will determine if and when we ask to be released. That is our responsibility and we don’t take it lightly. The decision will be influenced by the pace, participation and desire of the parties currently engaged in our negotiations to reach an agreement. If a release is called for, I ask you to stand firm with your brother and sister pilots and their families. It is no longer their family or your family – it is our family. The other airlines and their families in this industry are counting on us to succeed, to make this again a profession of which we can be proud. Together, we cannot fail. Our future depends on it; our children’s future depends on it.
It bears repeating that United has obtained a preliminary injunction against ALPA and the United pilots, barring the United pilots and ALPA from interfering with United’s operation prior to the end of the 30-day cooling-off period. Self-help prior to this time can lead to discipline and fines for contempt directed against individuals, fines directed against our union, interference with our ability to engage in self-help at the appropriate time and other negative restrictions on us that would otherwise not exist and that would seriously damage our bargaining leverage. We cannot let our frustrations provide management a tool that can only harm our interests and prevent us from exercising our legal rights under the RLA.
We value our customers and are proud of what we deliver. I know I speak for all pilots when I say that. As your leader I want you to know that the needs of our customers are also a top priority and no matter what transpires in the coming weeks, we owe it to our customers to provide them with information and clear guidance so that their travel plans are not disrupted.
Talk is cheap, but mergers are expensive. Problems need to be solved and sometimes the solutions cost money. That money should not come from the pockets of the pilots.
We are United,
Captain Jay Heppner
Chairman, United Master Executive Council
Dear United Pilots:
Many of you have heard or used the term “release” while our Railway Labor Act (RLA) Section 6 negotiations have been in mediation for quite some time. I would like to explain this term and how it may factor into our future. Perhaps the most important item to understand is what release is not; it is not a release from the status quo or our obligations under the injunction. Neither the company nor employees are free to engage in self-help when first “released.”
While negotiating under the Railway Labor Act (RLA), either party may request to be released from mediated negotiations. If the National Mediation Board (NMB) agrees, it will proffer arbitration and if, after 10 days both parties do not agree, then an impasse would be declared and a 30-day “cooling off” period would begin.
The term “cooling off” is a misnomer; your union, the NMB and certainly management would all be extremely busy during this 30-day countdown. The parties should then be committed to negotiating the JCBA if they are truly serious about its completion – more so than hitherto. This would be the beginning of the end-game to bargain under the RLA. While the RLA was written to protect the flow of commerce, the risk of interruption of that flow is finally a legal point of leverage.
ALPA National, and by extension our MEC, has a vast array of tools at their disposal to assist local Councils and our pilots. Technology is helpful, but the determining factor in any release scenario is the dedication of the individual pilot and his/her desire for a successful outcome.
There is a generic strike handbook published by ALPA. I tasked our SPSC to work with our counterparts at CAL SPSC to create and publish a “Joint United and Continental Strike Preparedness Manual 2012.” This will be our reference manual for training and job assignments. It is very explicit, technical and accurate. It is ready.
I, the MEC, and its Officers will determine if and when we ask to be released. That is our responsibility and we don’t take it lightly. The decision will be influenced by the pace, participation and desire of the parties currently engaged in our negotiations to reach an agreement. If a release is called for, I ask you to stand firm with your brother and sister pilots and their families. It is no longer their family or your family – it is our family. The other airlines and their families in this industry are counting on us to succeed, to make this again a profession of which we can be proud. Together, we cannot fail. Our future depends on it; our children’s future depends on it.
It bears repeating that United has obtained a preliminary injunction against ALPA and the United pilots, barring the United pilots and ALPA from interfering with United’s operation prior to the end of the 30-day cooling-off period. Self-help prior to this time can lead to discipline and fines for contempt directed against individuals, fines directed against our union, interference with our ability to engage in self-help at the appropriate time and other negative restrictions on us that would otherwise not exist and that would seriously damage our bargaining leverage. We cannot let our frustrations provide management a tool that can only harm our interests and prevent us from exercising our legal rights under the RLA.
We value our customers and are proud of what we deliver. I know I speak for all pilots when I say that. As your leader I want you to know that the needs of our customers are also a top priority and no matter what transpires in the coming weeks, we owe it to our customers to provide them with information and clear guidance so that their travel plans are not disrupted.
Talk is cheap, but mergers are expensive. Problems need to be solved and sometimes the solutions cost money. That money should not come from the pockets of the pilots.
We are United,
Captain Jay Heppner
Chairman, United Master Executive Council
Last edited by Airhoss; 04-16-2012 at 09:20 PM.
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 5,213
Likes: 14
From: guppy CA
Depends on the length of leave requested, fleet, and seat.
From Mar 2012 SSC report (page 2-3):
From Mar 2012 SSC report (page 2-3):
Short-term Leaves
The company continues to offer short-term LOAs. As previously stated, this is made
possible by an MOU covering leaves that commence on or before May 30, 2012, allowing
short-term leaves up to 90 days with benefits. The response for the LOAs has been strong,
with requests ranging anywhere from seven days to three months. The company reported
they had to deny some leave requests due to manpower shortages.
Time period LOA offer
September - November
October - December
Number of Pilots awarded leaves
possible by an MOU covering leaves that commence on or before May 30, 2012, allowing
short-term leaves up to 90 days with benefits. The response for the LOAs has been strong,
with requests ranging anywhere from seven days to three months. The company reported
they had to deny some leave requests due to manpower shortages.
Time period LOA offer
September - November
October - December
Number of Pilots awarded leaves
82
59
Mar 2012
sse Report
November - January
December - February
January- March
February-April
March-May
April-May (2 months only)
77
75
77
77
65
33
Future solicitations for LOAs will be on a month-to-month basis.
December - February
January- March
February-April
March-May
April-May (2 months only)
77
75
77
77
65
33
#8
Thread Starter
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 400
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So the latest SSC report seems to corroborate some of the rumors that have been flying about as of late.
What I'm wondering is are or will we see any effect on manpower from 65rs depleting benefits before hitting the Barcolounger?
And if United side does indeed recall in September as is being widely discussed, what does that mean for CAL classes this summer?
What I'm wondering is are or will we see any effect on manpower from 65rs depleting benefits before hitting the Barcolounger?
And if United side does indeed recall in September as is being widely discussed, what does that mean for CAL classes this summer?
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
From: 767 F/O
All of this doesn't matter .. we're gonna burn this place down before the end of the summer. You can't abuse your labor for 10 years without expecting retribution. I'm sooo tired of bankruptcy wages. Let's get released and shut this place down.
#10
Beers for intestinal fortitude!!!
Carpe Diem
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