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Quote:

Originally Posted by Freight Dawg (Post 1182036)

Dude, you just don't get it do you?

+1

Same guy that asked the most basic of process and organization questions, then goes on to post "insider" info from his "sources". :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Once United (Post 1181968)

Disappointed with the POS Moak and Pierce! What about the POS Heppner? He sold out the United pilots for the sake of ALPA National. Moak could care less about the UAL or CAL pilots. June will come and next June will follow and we'll still be without a contract. Really dissappointed in the Heppner actions. He knows he's being played by Moak and Pierce and caved - Maybe it's time for another recall. What do you think West Coasters?

I don't know that I agree with that. I too want to be released. Hep at least brought it up. If Moak said, point blank, "I'm not submitting your release request", then Moak is the one who sold us out. At that point it'd be a matter of damage control. There's the option to pull out of ALPA, but I think that has its own set of problems. I'm still backing Hepner. I'm not optimistic, but I'm also not going to tarnish the reputation of Heppner by slinging insults at him without all the facts. He has done more to advance us towards release than Wendy ever did. Just saying.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Bligh (Post 1182001)

????

Not me... If this summer slips through our fingers, our leverage is gone. I want to see pre determined accomplishment goals and specific gates.

Just like our training department suggests pilots use "gates" for criteria measurement points to consider the continuation of an approach, where when specifics are not met at the gate, a go-around is initiated, if our goals are not being met at gates of measure, we immediately return to seeking release.

If you're going to quote me, then leave it in context.

I pasted my post here again, but I bolded the parts you missed.

I'm cautiously optimistic, but I also suspect that the company is trying the tactic of trying to show a little light at the end of the tunnel, then withdrawing in an effort to wear us down and dump our spirits.

So, I got one word: SHOWMETHEMONEYSCOPEWORKRULESBENEFITS

I am in complete agreement with you, by the way, and didn't say anything to the contrary.

C/B

T/W
__________________

Cautiously optimistic!! Are you KIDDING ME!! How many times do you need to get bent over and lied to before say enough is enough! It's past time to throw down.

I'd have been cautiously optimistic if we were released and our cooling off period ended mid June. This is nothing more snake oil and BS!

Quote:

Yes, cautiously optimistic. But highly suspicious of management bait-and-switch. The cautious optimism is because of the Two Jays actually apparently in agreement on something. We can't win *** if they are at odds, so it's a big step, no?

T/W

Is the glass half full....

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1257 (Post 1181837)

May 4, 2012
Dear Fellow Pilot,
We write jointly to update all of you on our Joint Collective Bargaining Agreement (JCBA) negotiations and to discuss our joint steps going forward. We do this from our common recognition that we can and we must complete this negotiation.
Our Joint Negotiating Committee (JNC) has in fact made significant recent progress in scheduling and hours of service, but many issues remain. We have also agreed to dates for meetings on the critical issues of job security and scope, but we know that these are hard-fought issues. And we must also move on to the essential matter of our rates of pay.

So how can we complete the task at hand? This is our plan:

First, the two of us will meet next Tuesday with outside legislative/regulatory advisors in Washington, D.C., to help us build support within our government for intensive negotiations and for a firm time line, including consideration of a joint request for a release from mediation, to complete the job.
Second, on May 17 and 18, our two MECs will be meeting jointly in Washington, D.C., to confirm our course going forward.
Third, starting immediately and through the remainder of May, the JNC will negotiate intensively with management to close out as many of the open scheduling, job security/scope and benefit issues as possible.
Fourth—and this is key—at the end of May, we will commence concentrated bargaining, with involvement from the highest levels of the National Mediation Board (NMB) in Washington, D.C., to continue to the middle of June.

We are confident that the intensive efforts in May and the concentrated sessions in June can and should result in a comprehensive tentative agreement.
Differences between pilot groups are natural, even within the same union, and we’ve certainly had our share. But we share something more important—a common goal—to make sure that the contributions that every one of our pilots have made to the survival and success of our Company are fairly rewarded through our JCBA. And when we—all of us working together—have completed that goal, we will indeed be one pilot group ready for the future.
We need your unified support to reach this goal. We will jointly provide more information on a regular basis over the coming weeks.

Fraternally,

Capt. Jay Heppner

UAL MEC Chairman

Capt. Jay Pierce

CAL MEC Chairman

Gentlemen,

I for one am willing to hold you to your message. You have this published window of time to deliver...but not beyond...
Make us all proud to be UNITED!

Quote:

Originally Posted by throttleweenie (Post 1182194)

Yes, cautiously optimistic. But highly suspicious of management bait-and-switch. The cautious optimism is because of the Two Jays actually apparently in agreement on something. We can't win shįt if they are at odds, so it's a big step, no?

T/W

Yeah it's step for sure. But what are we going to do not if, but when the magical deadline comes and goes?

Send another strongly worded letter to management? :rolleyes:

We are squandering our summer opportunity here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pilotbiffster (Post 1182048)

I was critical of Pierce because he sold us out to the company. I hold Heppner to a higher standard. He knew with this meeting that Moak wanted to come away looking like the messiah. Pierce loved the fact he'd get a free ride after the stuff he's pulled since merger. Heppner came away looking like a lap boy. How long has it been since we got a contract? Heppner has been there - ask him. How many of the little deadlines have come and past? These guys are keeping money out of our pockets by playing games - Do you really feel they've earned the right to take/keep what's due you and your family. Every United Pilot should call or email their LEC reps and demand to know why Heppner folded. What did Heppner give away for this new found unity.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Once United (Post 1182219)

BS. You are barking up the wrong tree here. Name one person BESIDES Heppner who had done ANYTHING to advance negotiations?

Quote:

Originally Posted by throttleweenie (Post 1182194)

Yes, cautiously optimistic. But highly suspicious of management bait-and-switch. The cautious optimism is because of the Two Jays actually apparently in agreement on something. We can't win shįt if they are at odds, so it's a big step, no?

T/W

Au contraire. The summer is ripe. And it's co-widget himself who is painting himself into that corner. All we have to do is keep giving him paint and brushes.

And if the salaried co-widgets don't play by their agreed-upon rules, it will not bode well with the National Mediation Board.

Trust this to be true.

TW