Wow......the bar just got lower!

I cannot believe you just opened that door. Talk about classless and clueless. :confused:

Yeah, but it is still the truth. You can't argue with the truth, no matter how much you wish it wasn't.

Cite the numbers, dates, and causality....if you wanna take a jump into the muck...have the guts to cite specificity. Otherwise; it was simply an overstep on your part, going to a truly lowly place at the expense of those who died, for no other purpose than to assuage your ego to make a relatively meaningless point.

Such historical data does nothing to negate the fact that CAL has SERIOUS and glaring gaps in standardization and professional conduct in the cockpit. It's quite true...how many airlines do YOU have first-hand of (procedures an best practices) in your professional career to compare and contrast CAL's to? Please do tell...

Your "analysis" fails to mention that UAL is and always has been a much larger and more prolific global player in the world's air transport market than its CAL counterpart...further undermining any legitimacy of your somewhat spurious correlation which you're attempting to achieve...

Just sayin'...

Frats,
Horhay

All true. My view was a bit too simplistic. What I'm getting at is that stating that a wb staffs more than a nb is not always true.

According to one of the CAL merger committee members on another forum, that wasn't his opinion.

He talked about having a "chill lifestyle flying only 10 days a month" and living "the good life" as a widebody FO. In regards to flying 18 days a month as a 737 Captain he remarked "who'd want to do that"

But I'm SURE he has changed his position on that now.

DMC - what is your background and experience? Are you CAL or UAL? For background, I've got 4 years with U on the Guppy, 3 in the Bus, and 15 months with CAL on the turbo-Guppy(NG). From your post, you imply (per the "jumpseated on both...") that you've not actively flown at either airline, is that the case? While I appreciate your jumpseating observations, it's a far different experience than spending 3-4 days working with a pilot directly. If you are/were a CAL or UAL crew, I apologize for the omission.

Agreed-both companies have their toads, some of whom are deleriously poor pilots, many of whom are incapable (or prevented by management) of EVER upgrading; I can assure you that the level of competence, standardization, and professionalism is FAR higher at U than C. Granted, it's only a small snap-shot of one equipment type at one base...I do though believe this holds true in the bigger scheme as well.

The "merger of equals" tripe was simply a weak attempt by management to set the employee's expectations to avoid divisiveness commonly found in integrating disparate working groups. Reference Jeff's often-used, and completely meaningless use of the "co-worker" term. MBA-101 attempt to bring oneself to the "level" of the laboror (read labor groups) so as to engender team cohesion and inspire desired behavior for the sake of bolstering productivity metrics.

UAL purchased CAL with cash to avert a merger approval vote and avoid the failed result of the US air debacle in 2000.

Cheers,
Horhay

We have a few domestic id's on the 777, but rarely do we fly domestic. The only unaugmented flying I ever do is HNL or GUM. Last domestic id I flew was sometime last year. On 90% of my flights I have a bunkie with enough seniority to hold 320 or 767 Capt. Just choosing the better lifestyle. And FYI, the 777's I fly are all well equipped with GPS, IRS, CPDLC, Satcom etc.

SFO 777 CA.

The point is that he/she can hold BOTH, and has a choice! That fact should not change due to the merger! So now look at that choice and see why putting a furlough in front of that person changes their life. What choice does a furlough have? Certainly not the same as an active pilot...

Thanks auzcap,

I truly don't know ual's entire pre merger route system and I understand that you have great 777/747 routes. No dispute there. I also think that most of the ual pilots don't truly understand the cal pre merger system routes and operations. Cal flew a ton of augmented routes to overseas destinations but much of it was in nb aircraft.

By the way, I understand that you have GPS and satcom, but what about an espresso maker? Our 777's have them. That's got to be worth a couple of hundred seniority numbers!

How did you come to this conclusion? In all of the financial reports I have read, it was a straight stock transaction, with old CAL stock holders recieving a slight premimum compared to old UAL stock holders. The new holding company, UCH, was comprised of directors appointed in equal numbers by the old corportations/holding companies.