Scott, I agree with you about Probe's comments regarding interns, but short of listening to a scab complain about the union of contract, listening to someone who grabbed the "golden ticket" and was hired in their early to mid 20s complain, when most of us were busting our butts doing something so much harder than flying for a major, gets old pretty fast as well. Not saying you fit that profile, but understand where Probe might be coming from.

I'd tread lightly here, Scott, if I were you. I say with sincerity your accomplishments, drive and focus are remarkable. However, you're dismissing those who didn't get hired when you got the job as being unworthy. Most were in their 30s or older and had "been there, done that" in a way a 22 year old, no matter how accomplished couldn't. Would I have hired Scott Stoops at 25... little doubt in my mind, yes. At 22, I think it's tough to justify.

I certainly don't fault you there. In some way shape, or form, almost all of us got this job through our connections.

It actually began under Bush 41 and while significantly more competitive than in most of the 80s, military training wasn't "shut down."

Well deserved!

Agree with you there, but never forget the amount of luck involved in this profession and when someone gets hired out of what would be expected to be the normal order, someone else gets delayed or isn't hired at all.

 

Thats a great post XHooker!

 

Can't disagree with anything you wrote. Excellent post.

Scott

 

Could/Would you post the "normal order", please!

 

OK, you should have been dead last. Now, get back to pontificating on "reproductive health care".

 

Didn't start the thread - didn't bash a segment of the United pilot population but if you're tired of watching FOX and want to participate - Welcome!

 

Scott;
When I said interns had no business on a UAL forum, I didn't mean UAL pilots who were interns, I meant interns trying to be UAL pilots.

I have flown with numerous former interns, and flew with scabs and wannabe scabs for most of my first 6 years here. I stand by my assessment of both.

I also had the displeasure of being a coworker of a former UAL intern (never hired) a couple of years ago at another job, and it instantly brought back bad memories of how I got my opinion of interns.

When I first flew with scabs, I went in with a bad attitude towards them as I was told about them ahead of time. Not so with interns. Most of them earned it.

I stand by my opinion.

 

Interesting comment -

 

Fair enough, and I understand your position. I stand by mine as well. It seems absurd to discount an entire group of airmen in such a way. Your call.

On this forum, what exactly do you think this place is? It is a public forum that requires no documentation to participate. For all you know, I could be a 12 year old pretending to be an airline pilot. Personally, I think it is great that potential airline pilots are lurking, learning and posting on sites like this. Heck, I participate in a competitive archery forum to learn from those that are more accomplished than I. I do that here as well.

Personally, with the exception of scabs, I prefer to approach every pilot I fly with an open mind. To pigeon hole a pilot based solely on background is a pretty lousy approach to life IMHO. I have strong opinions about certain groups no doubt (as clearly you do as well), but I can't imagine going on a public site and discounting another group as you have.

On that, are you LCAL? There is no way flying for UAL that you would have spent most of your first 6 years flying with scabs. If so (meaning LCAL) have you flown with any LUAL interns?

Scott

 

Scott;
Nope. Lual, 95 hire. Spent first 6 years flying with scabs and 570, and me or the bunkie was hired post 1990. Most post 1990 hires were good guys/gals.

United was my 17th job. Hired when I was 32. My guess is UAL was your first, and now only, job. Hired at 22. Sorry, being an intern doesn't count. You weren't paid.

In 1995, if me and you did resumes under the same criteria, your work experience would be 1 inch long on a normal piece of paper. Mine would be 2.5 pages. Mine was simllar to all my classmates of Dec, 1995. We came from diverse backgrounds. But all of us were the same, under the sun.

What none of us were, back in Dec of 1995, were 22 year olds starting their first real job, ever.

LCAL?, A few days ago I did my last line check. My LCAL check airman, a couple of years younger than me, was telling me about his aviation experience (I asked). After he told me, I said, you know what, the guys that really had it bad, flew checks in the middle of the night, single pilot, IFR. He said, "OH Yeah, I did that for three years as well."

I stand by my opinion. 500 hour interns, or 3000 hours that daddy paid for, don't belong in front of the Q in front of 8000 hour pilots with 12 years of professional experience. And it shows when you fly with them.

Outstanding Airmanship Award? Congrats. I am sure you did a great job. So did all of us, numerous times, throughout all of our professional careers. I am not badmouthing what you did, but I would never, ever, brag about the award. Why?

Because all of us, professional aviators, have saved the day a few times in our careers. For the most part, the only ones that know about it are in front of the locked cockpit door. It is our job, and why we make the big bucks. After the flight, we shook hands, and went home.

I stand by what I said about interns, 100%.