Airline Pilot Central Forums - Whats with the jackets?

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- - Whats with the jackets? (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/united/84108-whats-jackets.html)

Quote:

Originally Posted by worstpilotever (Post 1733784)

Did i mention anything about the quality of said chicks? LOL

Go ugly early!!!:eek:

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilot64golfer (Post 1733470)

ALPA didn't take the pension. The company got rid of it in BK. ALPA has done far more for us as a group than "the company" ever did.

Golfer,

The union took the company's word (okay, PW and his BK negotiators) that the company would do all they could to save the pension if you give us BK1 contract. Nothing in writing, no snap back if the pension ended up terminated to counter the significant additional loss in total compensation (which was a foregone conclusion for anyone with common sense). Rolled over on many more things so the senior folks could have the A plan that was toast on day one.

Scared pilots took the bait. You can probably search the PBS website for Spraygen's commentary on the United BK to get better educated on the A plan demise and the fact it was done the day the company filed. All the company had to do was get "you" in the right mindset to accept it in the end game.

Frats,
Lee

Well the Navy guy actually earned those wings which make them infinitely more valuable than globe Wings, a.k.a. Dog**** wings

Quote:

Originally Posted by R57 relay (Post 1733686)

You were on my side about what?

I doubt Nicolau would have given us that since we didn't ask for it. But, if he had given us LOS, no I still had little use for them. While many of the US pilot problems came from the MEC, I think national failed on many issues and I'd rather have an in house union. That said, I voted for ALPA over USAPA, because of the situation.

Back to the topic. Sorry for crashing your UA party. I came here to see what you guys thought as I'm hearing some scary stuff about ours. I actually like UA's, although it appears they may not be of the best quality. Thoughts?

This is really off topic, but your forum doesn't welcome interlopers. I agree Nicolau got it wrong, rare but it happens. It is the reason the current thought is to use three arbitrators, previously that was considered redundant. Since the current arbitration scheme doesn't allow anyone to wiggle out, it looks like you guys are on the right track, good luck.

I took umbrage to your ALPA bashing. It doesn't matter what you call a union, ALPA, APA, USAPA etc., they all have the same dynamics. They are run foremost for the benefit of staff, the in house attorneys have limited skills and are afraid of upsetting the amateur politicians. The representatives who are elected are usually not the best and brightest, simply because the job is frustrating, time consuming and thankless. After losing $42M and $53M lawsuits it is fairly clear ALPA lacks national leadership, allowing the locals to run the train off the track. I don't see how a smaller in house union will do any better.
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When the pilot's started wearing bomber jackets with Skycap hats, it truly made the uniform's function as a marketing tool meaningless. As a second officer, who once was thrown off a trip for not wearing the hat in dispatch, I am a bit prejudice.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunvox (Post 1733312)

This has been shown both by ALPA and by the company to be incorrect. The public perception of what a "pilot" is includes the full monty with the hat and they (the public) "feel" better when you wear it.

Try this for an experiment: Go one month wearing a NorthFace fleece and no hat then switch to the regulation jacket and hat and count the number of times passengers engage and or comment positively to you in both cases.

I'm not a rah-rah hat guy, but I am willing to admit that it does make a big difference in public perception, and if the folks writing my paycheck are asking me to wear the uniform and my union is onboard then I have no problem doing as asked. There's no harm in looking professional, and a 3 or 4 man cockpit crew wearing the full uniform together draws significantly more attention and respect than a bunch of guys walking together with NorthFace fleeces.

Maybe just maybe wearing the uniform DOES matter and DOES improve our professional image which certainly can't hurt and doesn't actually cost you anything personally. Why else does ALPA ask us to show up when picketing with the full uniform?

Right on! I too am one of the minority that thinks a hat is part of the uniform...it does present a more professional looking pilot to the public. That being said, I've got better things to do than be "hat police"...:)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gofastmopar (Post 1734884)

The FOM states that the hat is optional. So this is moot. Some guys want everyone to wear a hat and other just want to follow the FOM. So the "hat police" want everyone to wear a hat even though the FOM says it is optional.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilot64golfer (Post 1734920)

Not anymore...
The FOM used to have certain sections with differences between LUAL and LCAL
Not now.
FOM 1.80.1

Quote:

Originally Posted by Short Bus Drive (Post 1735017)

Not anymore...
The FOM used to have certain sections with differences between LUAL and LCAL
Not now.
FOM 1.80.1

Keep reading. It also states this under "hat" "Uniform hat must be worn whenever the uniform coat is worn". The hat is only required if you are wearing the coat. If you wear a "black leather jacket" you aren't wearing the coat. See "leather jacket". The hat is not mandatory at all times. Only when wearing the coat.

Nothing has changed.

I never wore my hat when in my USAF bag, why start now?:D

The hat makes us all look like a charter bus driver. Maybe thats what we all are, but, I dont think thats a good look.