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-   -   Western Global/21Air contracting to end (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ups/114746-western-global-21air-contracting-end.html)

BoilerUP 09-22-2018 03:42 AM


Originally Posted by Asiabound (Post 2678862)
Is this for sure to end?

All UPS-subcontracted flying currently performed by Western Global and 21Air to be transferred to IPA pilots flying Browntails no later than 29 June 2019, per an arbitrator’s consent award.

Asiabound 09-22-2018 04:16 AM


Originally Posted by BoilerUP (Post 2678886)
All UPS-subcontracted flying currently performed by Western Global and 21Air to be transferred to IPA pilots flying Browntails no later than 29 June 2019, per an arbitrator’s consent award.

Got it. One of the versions/responses that I'm hearing is the UPS management will bite the bullet, continue the contract, and just pay more vacation days as a penalty to the pilots and the union because it's still cheaper. Is that possible? JW

BoilerUP 09-22-2018 04:18 AM

Only if UPS wants to flaunt an arbitrator's decision.

I see absolutely ZERO circumstance in which the IPA would agree to an extension beyond the arbitrator's consent award, ESPECIALLY given we've taken delivery of five 748 and one 763BCF this year, will take one more 748 and two more 763BCFs by the end of the year, and in 2019 will get six additional 748s and four or five factory new 763s.

The company can't claim "we don't have lift!" anymore.

Asiabound 09-22-2018 06:29 AM


Originally Posted by BoilerUP (Post 2678895)
Only if UPS wants to flaunt an arbitrator's decision.

I see absolutely ZERO circumstance in which the IPA would agree to an extension beyond the arbitrator's consent award, ESPECIALLY given we've taken delivery of five 748 and one 763BCF this year, will take one more 748 and two more 763BCFs by the end of the year, and in 2019 will get six additional 748s and four or five factory new 763s.

The company can't claim "we don't have lift!" anymore.

Got it. That's what I thought, thanks for the clarification. Hopefully I'll be on your team someday.

Safe travels.

howardhughes8 09-22-2018 07:47 AM


Originally Posted by BoilerUP (Post 2678895)
Only if UPS wants to flaunt an arbitrator's decision.

I see absolutely ZERO circumstance in which the IPA would agree to an extension beyond the arbitrator's consent award, ESPECIALLY given we've taken delivery of five 748 and one 763BCF this year, will take one more 748 and two more 763BCFs by the end of the year, and in 2019 will get six additional 748s and four or five factory new 763s.

The company can't claim "we don't have lift!" anymore.

And to add one more piece, the award is enforceable in court, meaning we can get an immediate injunction IF the company doesn’t end it by the specified date. Language was pretty clear. Never know what can happen, but the arbitrators decision was pretty clear and gives the IPA a clear win in case the company wants to do it again (outside of the normal subcontracting allowed).

FrontSeat2 09-23-2018 07:57 AM


Originally Posted by howardhughes8 (Post 2678989)
And to add one more piece, the award is enforceable in court, meaning we can get an immediate injunction IF the company doesn’t end it by the specified date. Language was pretty clear. Never know what can happen, but the arbitrators decision was pretty clear and gives the IPA a clear win in case the company wants to do it again (outside of the normal subcontracting allowed).

The company is not going to end it and 2 maybe 4 years from now we will have a few more banked vacation days. Big Fing deal, and this is what most crews are talking about aside from the bar and grill where it is forbidden to express your views unless you align with the 10 people who post on there.

I rather have the jobs (you cannot say that on the bar and grill). BV days do not add much to a persons life that is borderline becoming a captain or junior in their seat and would like a few extra bodies under them. It really only benefits the senior captains.

The company won. Not fair and not square.

howardhughes8 09-23-2018 10:06 AM


Originally Posted by FrontSeat2 (Post 2679495)
The company is not going to end it and 2 maybe 4 years from now we will have a few more banked vacation days. Big Fing deal, and this is what most crews are talking about aside from the bar and grill where it is forbidden to express your views unless you align with the 10 people who post on there.

I rather have the jobs (you cannot say that on the bar and grill). BV days do not add much to a persons life that is borderline becoming a captain or junior in their seat and would like a few extra bodies under them. It really only benefits the senior captains.

The company won. Not fair and not square.

Have you read the summary judgement with the clear language regarding court enforcement? If the company does not stop it by end date, the IPA will have a court injunction the next day, yes, it was that clear. I don’t know where you are getting your info.

FrontSeat2 09-23-2018 11:07 AM


Originally Posted by howardhughes8 (Post 2679544)
If the company does not stop it by end date, the IPA will have a court injunction the next day, yes, it was that clear.

I am LOL so hard....

SonnyD 09-23-2018 02:11 PM


Originally Posted by FrontSeat2 (Post 2679495)
The company is not going to end it and 2 maybe 4 years from now we will have a few more banked vacation days. Big Fing deal, and this is what most crews are talking about aside from the bar and grill where it is forbidden to express your views unless you align with the 10 people who post on there.

I rather have the jobs (you cannot say that on the bar and grill). BV days do not add much to a persons life that is borderline becoming a captain or junior in their seat and would like a few extra bodies under them. It really only benefits the senior captains.

The company won. Not fair and not square.

The number of crews I've heard express this sentiment is zero, but I've also noticed the crews I fly with tend to be on the well informed side.

I, too would rather have the jobs. Thanks to the arbitrator's ruling, hiring IPA pilots is now the most cost-effective way to move volume subject to Article One. Job well done.

I'm not a senior captain, but I'm happy to have the BV days. I get that you're not, and I respect that.

767pilot 09-24-2018 04:57 AM


Originally Posted by FrontSeat2 (Post 2679495)
It really only benefits the senior captains

I was sort of with you most of the way but I stop here. I guess people would call me a senior captain at this point and a bv day or two is not any more valuable to me than to a junior person, arguably less as I'm largely able to avoid the short trips that those help with. I know of no one at any seniority level that wouldn't want more IPA bodies under them.


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