CaptainHvac

This thread has helped hundreds of pilots get hired at Atlas (including myself), and has educated hundreds more in this tumultuous career. As with any Internet forum, one must read every post and not put too much belief in any one poster, but rather get an overall feel from multiple posts to find your answer. In light of recent developments within the Atlas business model and the potential (probably very likely) acquisition of Southern Air, there have been some changes that might affect a pilot’s decision. There have been some posts in this forum, as well as the Cargo forum, that portray a “sky is falling” mentality. There is nearly the same amount of posts that suggest ignoring the recent Atlas negatives and to pick a job based on what type of flying you’d like to do. None of us can predict the future, and if we could we probably wouldn’t be working for a w2… Here are some facts from recent events that you can mull over and add to your research in order to make an informed decision yourself.

Atlas management chose to tell the Union about the Southern Air acquisition 10 minutes before the public announcement. This is and has been the amount of respect shown to the Union at nearly every turn. If you don’t think this is that big of a deal, the respect middle management (daily operations) shows to the pilots comes from the top down. It’s odd because it’s not a daily basis type of beat down. It’s like the frog in the pot of warm water that slowly comes to a boil without it noticing. Before long you’re cooked, fried, just beat down, and you wonder how it happened so subtly. We have an “epic fail” union message that’s brilliant, true, and sad. We also have many pilots who portray the “battered wife” syndrome resulting from years of this type of management. Wait until you fly with one of these guys, its unreal.

In the meetings following the announcement between Atlas and the Union, the Atlas management team showed their hand in a surprisingly arrogant move. They chose this time to finally follow the Atlas contract (more specifically section 1) and Atlas/Southern will amalgamate their CBA’s if they get their way. I don’t know if they’ll get their way, but do you think they have a strong case??? They’re just following what both parties (Atlas and Teamsters) agreed upon in the current CBA.

In response to these meetings, the Atlas EXCO Chairman said in our recent conference call, “THIS IS CAREER DEVASTATING! This was an honest reaction to management’s plans because it’s the absolute truth. If you follow the roadmap management has planned out in the meetings, it leads right to our Chairman’s quote.

Another interesting thing the Chairman said that relates to his first quote is, “THERE IS A SCENARIO IN AMALGAMATION IN WHICH THE ATLAS CBA COULD COME DOWN TO THE SOUTHERN CBA.” The Southern CBA is a bankruptcy CBA, and is nearly the worst in the industry (no fault of their pilots, of course). Atlas already has a substandard CBA and in desperate need of improvement. This can actually happen folks, and the Unions hands will be tied in front an Arbitrator. You might be working MORE THAN 17 days for LESS MONEY in the near future. At the very least, the fighting will have us working under the substandard CBA for years to come. Management is beginning to execute a terrible plan wonderfully and our careers will be the victims.

Management has told our Union that they will be trying to hire pilots who don’t want to, or cant leave to the Legacy carriers. ***? I honestly put myself in this category, and this is so offensive to me. I know many of you are in this camp as well, so what do you think about this attitude? Do you deserve to be paid and treated like the professional that you are? A resounding YES!

I’ve read that some of you are trying to leave less than desirable operators (I came from one myself) and it seems like many posters have good pt. 121 airline and Union experience. For those of you who are from the Regionals, remember what your management/union relationship was like, and how hard you fought everyday for years to get a few more dollars per hour. The Atlas fight is about to be much worse. Think about it: A company like Atlas making massive profits but still arrogantly and publicly displaying their intent to beat us down. We were about to negotiate much deserved improvements in our CBA, not have to fight for the crap we already have! Can you imagine getting your resume ready as a 55 year old -400 Captain? That’s happening now. The morale of the Atlas pilots is plummeting because of what’s coming down the pipe. Poor morale at Mesa, Republic, or PSA? Ask yourself if the morale at Atlas will be better than your garbage regional when we’re fighting in the trenches with the rich and powerful AAWH. Are you familiar with Ford and Harrison? Yeah, Atlas retains F&H and they are extremely effective.

Some of you are coming from other ACMI carriers, so you know what this could be like. I imagine our amalgamated contract looking like the Kalitta CBA, or possibly worse. What do you think? They’ve laid out their cards and their execution will be flawless. History proves that they are very successful in getting what they want.

This could all be quite the shock when you read the Atlas CBA, research routes, schedules, talk with your Family, and decide to apply and get hired. In short order, the CBA you came here for that you didn’t think would be that bad is amalgamated, morale plummets, you’re gone away from home more, and your career has stagnated. You’ll eventually wake up, dust off the old resume and say to yourself, “what just happened?!?!

Now the flip side is that your airplane will be neato frito and you’ll get to see the world. Big F’ing deal. What you will give up to do that is not worth it to any self respecting person. It’s my opinion that we have one chance. AAWH only understands money, and their airplanes piloted by us make a freaking ton of it. In order for us to force them to see the light we will have to take precise, brutal, and unified actions. This is going to be the biggest and most savage fight the industry has ever seen because it’s the only possible way. If you chose to come to Atlas, you will be required to fight every day, from the very first day, including while on probation. There will be no honeymoon and you will be forced to sacrifice many things. Fasten your seatbelts, because the only way this could work is through severe turbulence and structural integrity is not guaranteed.

plift

Something to consider in deciding to come here, this is what needs to happen and a lot of our pilots are starting to think along these lines. This is especially true of a lot of the newer/younger pilots. However it may all be for nothing because we have a few special flowers that will always bend over backwards to help the company(and make some extra $ or pick up somebody else's HNL or SYD trip).

Not trying to scare anyone off, but if you come here, come informed, and be ready for a fight.

captainv

It's all here in these pages, trust me.

But what the hey...

CVG is junior. You can get the other base when your seniority allows it and a spot opens. How long it took the last guy isn't what it'll take for you, so not really worth looking it up.

The type of flying mostly done by the 767: cargo, pax, charter, ACMI, CMI and so on.

- Domestic night cargo hub turns out of CVG on the 767-200.
- International cargo runs in Asia on the 767-300F. there's a rice run that does TPE-NGO-ICN-TPE most nights. We also have a NRT-SYD run. Used to go back to TPE, i think now it goes back to NRT or sometimes PVG.
- AMC pax on the 767-300ERs. usually from CONUS to Hahn, Germany and then Kuwait or to bases in the Mediterranean and then back. We also do SEA-Japan for AMC, but that sometimes gets rotated to other carriers for a while.
- occasional pax charters on the 767-300ERs
- VIP charters on a VIP configured 767-200ER, usually sports teams.

(I've been off the jet since last summer, how'd I do?)

geekmaster

March 14 B747 class

Job Fair- 1/8
Written test- 1/12
Interview- 1/19
Pool- 1/22

TT= 12,400+
Jet PIC= 9,000ish All CR/2/7/9

Tenacvols

Good to know, I'll leave the Vette at home...

levishor

Thank you Captainv. I appreciate you taking the time.

900drver

When did they call you ?

geekmaster

Today around 3:30pm

EP3driver

I got the call today as well for the March 14th class.

TT-2800 Military (P-3/EP-3)
TPIC-1600
Instructor-800
1 internal rec

12/1 Submitted PAQ and resume
1/8 Job fair
1/9 Test invite
1/13 Phone interview
1/21 Interview
1/22 Preferential hiring pool

Professor Chaos

Not too bad CaptainV, but I'll add just a bit more from a current perspective...

The JFK base is a tiny fraction the size of the CVG base. But the bases are largely irrelevant. The original intent was for JFK to do the pax flying and the CVG base to do the DHL Express hub stuff. That didn't last very long, though. There is always a sizable chunk of pax flying in the CVG bid packet, and the JFK packet is usually filled with CVG reserve lines.

We do have one 767-300 in CVG doing the hub flying (it is a former Atlas pax bird that was reconfigured as a freighter last year). Also, the company has 2 -200's that are designated as "hot spares" for the DHL operation. Atlas assigns crews to these aircraft nightly, which require the pilots to sit in the DHL facility (which is a fairly new building and reasonably comfortable) for 6 hours each night. Since the spares are there to ensure operational integrity, it's basically luck of the draw whether you get activated to go rescue a flight. Some weeks you'll do nothing, while others will see you launch every night.

Don't plan on seeing any of the VIP charter flying for awhile. Those trips are pretty nice, and thus go senior. But you might get really lucky and stumble into a trip if you're sitting reserve.

All of the Asia 767 flying begins in CVG. The company DH's you on a 747 that goes non-stop to NRT (sometimes you go to ICN and then commercial or DH down to NRT/TPE). My first 2 years I was in Asia a lot, and I had more hours on the 747 than I had flying the 767. That's because of the way our flying lines are built on the 767. The highest number of block hours I've flown in a single month in the last 3 years here at Atlas on the 767 is 45.

Overall, the 767 is a great airplane to fly, and the crews are great. I spoke with someone rather high up in management last night who said the company's plan is to eventually operate more 767's than we have 747's on property right now. 50, I believe, was the number floated.

That tracks with info I heard from a different management type a couple months ago regarding the aggressive growth plans for the 767 fleet here.

For those looking to get on with Atlas, the management type (who is involved with hiring) said the next big batch of interviews will be in late March. Atlas will also be attending WIA earlier in March. Still no insight into the hiring process, other than HR seems to be adjusting their "pre-screening" process such that the hiring rate for face to face interviewees will be high (something around 80% of interviewees were offered employment in the January interviews). Based on the conversation last night, getting face time with Atlas hiring reps at job fairs like WIA is one of the best things you can do to increase your chances of getting called for a face to face interview in Miami/Purchase.

Hope this helps any new guys/prospective new guys.