It's more efficient for the airlines, while at the same time being more flexible for pilots.

The trick is to not let the airline have so much control over that efficiency that it degrades pilot QOL and flexibility to levels worse than line bidding.

Frankly I'd rather have PBS even if it cost me a day or maybe even two at home... often being able to pick the days at home is better than me just being home when the family is otherwise occupied. But I don't think it has to cost you anything, that's mostly in the pairing build.

It can be a win/win. Any airline will probably take more than their fair share of the win... if you let them.

 

Symbian, if you are not being sarcastic, go ahead and PM me. I've done line bidding and also PBS bidding for the past 17 years. Would be happy to discuss my experience with both.

But as a gross simplification, even if the pairings are sub-standard.. it's better to choose which substandard pairings you'll fly and what days of the week you will fly them on. This is HUGE when you need certain days off for family events.

In my case, I actually like red-eyes. I pick them up and always get the days off that I want. I win, and the AM flyers win because they can choose what type of pairing that they want.

Fellow PBS-ers please chime in here. I am not the foremost expert on this, just someone who's been tremendously pleased with my schedule for the past 17 years using PBS at two different airlines. For the readers of this who think that I'm letting the cat out of the bag and ruining bargaining leverage by admitting that some pilots want PBS, I respectfully disagree. Management already knows that a lot of pilots prefer to build their schedules than have pre-build, canned lines. A retired airline management exec who is a family friend actually laughed at me when I suggested PBS was some powerful bargaining chip in future negotiations. Anecdotal, I know... but it really changed my opinion on the matter.

And there are some things in life that are not zero-sum. Sometimes something that is good for a work group is also good for management and vice-versa. I believe EFB's would fall into that category.

I remember when EFB's first came out, pilots were actually COMPLAINING that they couldn't highlight things on their charts anymore.

My point is, pilots can be brilliant in working against their best interests (forgive me for the directness of that statement/opinion).

I truly write this with respect to all pilots. My wish is that we all educate ourselves, fight for, and DEMAND a decent work/life balance.

Life is short. Days off are precious. Let's get together and fight for a system that allows everyone to win (aka, pilots that want to fly 90 hours win, and pilots that want to fly 70 hours win. Pilots that want to fly PM's win, and the AM flyers win as well). Bidding systems such as this already exist.

 

Not sarcastic this time. I am at NK, so I've been reading up on PBS and cautiously optimistic about the change for me (I need to bid around my wife on a weekly based schedule, and most of our lines are atrocious 14 days off total, 4/5 on, 4/5 off). For us most of the loss came from loss of transition and vacation overlap.

 

All things being equal on the scheduling provisions in the contract, PBS is more flexible. It will definitely allow you to bid around your wife's schedule, typically in one shot, even if her days off vary from week to week.

Over the years on the VX side, I've basically never missed an important family commitment/business meeting/social event at home.... unless I really wanted to

 

Yep.. If I'm gonna get crappy trips, let me serve myself the crappy trips I prefer cause at least I'll probably be able to wrangle the days off I want without breaking a sweat.

And yes.... Give airline managers credit... They've known for a long time that PBS is a win-win for both sides and that pilots will/do like it. It's an open secret..

The question is, down the road, are we willing to NOT vote it in if necessary, if the scheduling provisions suck. I love PBS, but personally, I'm willing to walk away from that deal, if the scheduling language is not satisfactory.

We've got to get PBS right, the first time it ever shows up on property.

 

Crew Access cutover by October means we'll be bidding in September using the new system. We can't even get into Crew Access right now. They say there'll be training. Right, just like that Fedex letter some of us are supposed to receive. Most likely they are gonna just open it up to us in September and it's gonna be a self-study learn by trial. We have no clue what Step trading 1 and 2 look like in real life. Will they spend the resources to let us do a mock trial run of line bidding, step trading, and all the other crap that's necessary to form a schedule?

 

I asked to do a parallel bid and got shot down. As for PBS vs line bidding, at the end of the day the company builds pairings the way they see fit. They then toss them into 1 big pot. Now, would you rather dig out of the pot and make your own line or have the company dig out of the pot and make all the lines? See, line bidding gives the company more control period. That’s what many complain about PBS, but in reality it’s the other way around. PBS gives the company more efficient pilots, this less of them in which they want to utilize it.

 

This might be hearsay but isn’t one of the reasons we stopped hiring into the Airbus is because management found how to maximize efficiency with your PBS system and now finds the Airbus side overstaffed? In CQ, one of the instructors said the Airbus staffing model was way off and the company is now exploiting the loopholes. Yes, hiring has frozen on both airplanes but it stopped for the Bus long before the Boeing and I’ve heard when it resumes, it will be Boeing first. So do these “efficiencies” equate to even less hiring? I understand the QOL on the Airbus is slipping further and further away, from what it was, as AAG takes total control of the system. I would be hesitant to accept any system that furthers managements stranglehold of our “efficiency” while furthering the stagnation of pilot hiring. Plus, when the pot of pairings gets picked through, what’s left for the junior guys? When I worked under PBS, there wasn’t much left for anyone under 25-30% in the seat.

 

The junior guys do fine too. When I was 80% I still did pretty good for my trips bid, and more importantly my days off bid. As for the rest, the airbus hiring stopped end of January followed quickly by Boeing. The 4% growth rate is the main reason for the slowdown. On the Airbus side, it’s also the repainting and new interiors that is going to happen on the entire fleet in 18 months. That’s a fairly aggressive schedule, and will take planes out for weeks at a time. And yeah, we’re overstaffed on the Airbus side. That’s why there are daily emails offering premium pay to cover trips.

Serious question: why would anyone come here anymore? 620 retirements in 10 years out of 2,900. That’s barely 21% of the list. If you want ANC there’s Fedex/UPS. SEA is Delta, SF United, and LAX all 4 legacy carriers. PDX is the only unique AS base.

 

"Serious question: why would anyone come here anymore? 620 retirements in 10 years out of 2,900. That’s barely 21% of the list. If you want ANC there’s Fedex/UPS. SEA is Delta, SF United, and LAX all 4 legacy carriers. PDX is the only unique AS base."

People will come but they won't stay.