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Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
(Post 3674580)
You guys showed us how it’s done. You did so great that you had to go back to the company after the United deal to ask for more. That’s how to lead the industry.
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What is Delta top widebody pay on January 1st 2027? AA is $488/hr.
Who has the best LTD? Can Delta or United pilots get two months off in a row paid. Every year. We call it IMAX. Are you flying over 85 hours on reserve? Can United and Delta pilots drop down to Zero hours? Do United or Delta wide body First Officers go unqualified every three months for lack of landings? Great deal. Are United or Delta pilots getting $200,000 for unused sick time? There is a tremendous amount of nonsense spewed all around. Some contracts are better than others in different areas. Cherry picking certain items from a contract is easy. Unless you are actually working and living a contract you don’t know. Envy and jealousy are no good for you. I would put my career at AA up against any other airline career of a person hired the same day I was. The entitled generation is strong amongst us. I’ll give you a trophy for your so superior contract if that makes you happier. Good Grief. |
Originally Posted by FangsF15
(Post 3674562)
We ALL do better when each peer is raising the bar to some degree…….
(Unpopular opinion coming in 3, 2, 1,…) While I’m thankful for the heavy lifting that Delta and United pilots did for us, I don’t want to live in a world of perpetual complaining and perpetual contract negotiate because the other guys got more. None of us get everything we would like to see in a contract. That’s just the nature of “negotiations”. I’m okay with APA taking one more bite at the Apple but then I just want to go about quietly doing my job and living my life with the deal that I’m given. And if, by chance I find the final deal to be untenable for me, personally, I’m free to apply to Delta, United, Southwest, UPS, or anywhere else. Four years of bittching, whining, and being urinated-off is long enough. Now flame away! |
Originally Posted by Varks
(Post 3674590)
What is Delta top widebody pay on January 1st 2027? AA is $488/hr.
Who has the best LTD? Can Delta or United pilots get two months off in a row paid. Every year. We call it IMAX. Are you flying over 85 hours on reserve? Can United and Delta pilots drop down to Zero hours? Do United or Delta wide body First Officers go unqualified every three months for lack of landings? Great deal. Are United or Delta pilots getting $200,000 for unused sick time? There is a tremendous amount of nonsense spewed all around. Some contracts are better than others in different areas. Cherry picking certain items from a contract is easy. Unless you are actually working and living a contract you don’t know. Envy and jealousy are no good for you. I would put my career at AA up against any other airline career of a person hired the same day I was. The entitled generation is strong amongst us. I’ll give you a trophy for your so superior contract if that makes you happier. Good Grief. How many 18 month DAL/UAL folks were gone from home 150 hours in July and got paid 125? No sick, no vacation, just using the available tools. I’m guessing not many. We absolutely need to use examples from other airlines for negotiating with our management. Don’t conflate that with jealousy. |
Would love to know how involved these new troll accounts were in their union negotiations. I'm guessing not at all.
Yawn. |
Originally Posted by dsevo
(Post 3674576)
Another OAL know-it-all with wrong info. Profit sharing is pensionable. Sit pay is over 2 hours “scheduled” on UAL AIP, exactly like AA current sit pay. AA new sit will be actual, which is an improvement to current book IMO. Also UAL is 1:3 DOS, AA is and remains 1:2. I prefer AA AIP sick to either of the other two. AA LTD is no question industry leading, why didn’t UAL pattern off of that and improve?
My point, this whining about pattern bargaining on pay rates is retarded. Go away. We certainly have our own **** to work out, but I still wouldn’t trade spots. The payout at retirement is the only thing better in our TA in regards to sick. Given the amount of 25 hour 4 days there are in the system, 2 sick calls wipe out your annual accrual pretty much and getting sick twice a year is NOT unreasonable. It's great that we got that perk, but everything else about our sick rules is punitive. I'm a likely yes on this TA, but sorry sick is the biggest negatives on it. Even worse now that UAL got 6 hours accrual plus ESB and we are still stuck at 5 hours and calling out on the wrong trips burn the majority of our annual accrual because there is no way to stop burning sick or fly it back like UAL/DAL have the ability to do. |
Originally Posted by Varks
(Post 3674590)
What is Delta top widebody pay on January 1st 2027? AA is $488/hr.
Who has the best LTD? Can Delta or United pilots get two months off in a row paid. Every year. We call it IMAX. Are you flying over 85 hours on reserve? Can United and Delta pilots drop down to Zero hours? Do United or Delta wide body First Officers go unqualified every three months for lack of landings? Great deal. Are United or Delta pilots getting $200,000 for unused sick time? There is a tremendous amount of nonsense spewed all around. Some contracts are better than others in different areas. Cherry picking certain items from a contract is easy. Unless you are actually working and living a contract you don’t know. Envy and jealousy are no good for you. I would put my career at AA up against any other airline career of a person hired the same day I was. The entitled generation is strong amongst us. I’ll give you a trophy for your so superior contract if that makes you happier. Good Grief. |
Originally Posted by Varks
(Post 3674590)
What is Delta top widebody pay on January 1st 2027? AA is $488/hr. 3% post amendable is a gain, I would grant. But there is also a potential downside in that the company is incentivized to just drag the next contract out.
Who has the best LTD? Are you taking about the "no cap", which affects maybe 5% of those on LTD? Not a huge win, but not nothing either. What WAS AA's LTD before this AIP? Can Delta or United pilots get two months off in a row paid. Every year. We call it IMAX. DL does not have this, so I can grant that Are you flying over 85 hours on reserve? NO. It's theoretically possible, but extraordinarily rare (and lots of tools to prevent it in the first place) Can United and Delta pilots drop down to Zero hours? YES. Though it may be easier at AA, I don't know. Do United or Delta wide body First Officers go unqualified every three months for lack of landings? Great deal. YES, happens all the time. Are United or Delta pilots getting $200,000 for unused sick time? No. Another 'win' for AA in certain circumstances. But Again, there are downsides, and DL quickly ramps up to get 240-270 sick hours annually? Pro/Con to both systems. There is a tremendous amount of nonsense spewed all around. Some contracts are better than others in different areas. Cherry picking certain items from a contract is easy. Unless you are actually working and living a contract you don’t know. Envy and jealousy are no good for you. I would put my career at AA up against any other airline career of a person hired the same day I was. The entitled generation is strong amongst us. I’ll give you a trophy for your so superior contract if that makes you happier. Good Grief. So let's be intellectually honest. Any reading of the major parts, and a lot of minor parts, of UA's, then AA's contract AIP's look strikingly similar to a DL pilot. You could almost copy/past most of the bullet points, right down to the 'retro' being 4/4/14. And that was only after AA's first AIP was so horrid it's not worth even describing. So give credit where credit is due. Alaska got off to a good start. DL raised the bar significantly. UA then raised it some more (thanks, UA). Hopefully, WN will bring the 737 rates up well above all of us to bargain against next time. AA got the vast majority of their gains this round through the work of other unions. UA and DL simply want APA to pull some meaningful weight, and are rightfully frustrated about it. That's all. |
Originally Posted by Varks
(Post 3674590)
What is Delta top widebody pay on January 1st 2027? AA is $488/hr.
Who has the best LTD? Can Delta or United pilots get two months off in a row paid. Every year. We call it IMAX. Are you flying over 85 hours on reserve? Can United and Delta pilots drop down to Zero hours? Do United or Delta wide body First Officers go unqualified every three months for lack of landings? Great deal. Are United or Delta pilots getting $200,000 for unused sick time? There is a tremendous amount of nonsense spewed all around. Some contracts are better than others in different areas. Cherry picking certain items from a contract is easy. Unless you are actually working and living a contract you don’t know. Envy and jealousy are no good for you. I would put my career at AA up against any other airline career of a person hired the same day I was. The entitled generation is strong amongst us. I’ll give you a trophy for your so superior contract if that makes you happier. Good Grief. Delta has no cap on their LTD as well and the monies are eligible for profit sharing, AA does have no offsets. Delta also has a max credit for reserves thats varys month to month almost never above 85hrs. Yes at Delta you can drop to zero. Are you kidding me about the landings? You think thats unique to AA? Are AA pilots getting loaded with 275hrhrs of sick time per year, every year? Over a long career even using half that sick time is far more valauable than 200k. Different types of sick systems. Before you get all righteous about misinformation, I suggest you get your own facts straight. |
Originally Posted by T773ER
(Post 3674648)
Youre really comparing one pay rate in 4 years that was specifically cherry picked not to trigger snap up as a "win"? You are the problem. And 2027 is a contract cycle away, come back in a couple years.
Delta has no cap on their LTD as well and the monies are eligible for profit sharing, AA does have no offsets. Delta also has a max credit for reserves thats varys month to month almost never above 85hrs. Yes at Delta you can drop to zero. Are you kidding me about the landings? You think thats unique to AA? Are AA pilots getting loaded with 275hrhrs of sick time per year, every year? Over a long career even using half that sick time is far more valauable than 200k. Different types of sick systems. Before you get all righteous about misinformation, I suggest you get your own facts straight. We are being played. |
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