AMR Files For Bankruptcy
12-02-2011, 06:03 PM
#292
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by Josephus
I think that is the first post from you, 80 that I have seen that was not above the belt. It was a little more complicated than that.
My sincerest apologies!
What I was trying to say was that the "stapling" that occurred in the FL/WN SLI was not due to an arbiter or a "typical" process. Albeit horribly worded and not at all thought through.
I'll don the cone of shame now...
12-03-2011, 06:09 AM
#295
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Position: Right Seat
Posts: 136
80
That's the 80 I know! Good example to the rest of us on here how to keep it civil.
Nicely done, sir.
And a gentle reminder to everyone else... Forgive and forget. He said it, it's over.
--Dad hat off, now.
Nicely done, sir.
And a gentle reminder to everyone else... Forgive and forget. He said it, it's over.
--Dad hat off, now.
12-03-2011, 07:15 AM
#296
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,619
Originally Posted by Josephus
That's the 80 I know! Good example to the rest of us on here how to keep it civil.
Nicely done, sir.
And a gentle reminder to everyone else... Forgive and forget. He said it, it's over.
--Dad hat off, now.
Nicely done, sir.
And a gentle reminder to everyone else... Forgive and forget. He said it, it's over.
--Dad hat off, now.
12-03-2011, 02:39 PM
#297
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Position: A320/A319/B737 Sys Acft Maint Controller
Posts: 303
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
There are signs that Arpey is a "true believer" who had the inclination to pay American's bills. His board tried a spin off of Eagle before realizing that promoting an IPO in front of a pre-planned bankruptcy would likely land someone in jail. Logical disconnects like this suggest that American Management was doing a poor job of gaming the system.
Bankruptcy will help American while harming its competitors. Despite some competitors licking their chops to bite (by buying into) some part of American's network, what will happen is that the competitors' lending costs will increase while American's will decrease.
Expect American to follow the US Air / United / Delta / NWA model in less than 12 months.
American is NOT looking to merge. CNBC is calling for a trans border merger, but it is illegal under current law. American has a large enough network to compete with American and UCAL.
Bankruptcy will help American while harming its competitors. Despite some competitors licking their chops to bite (by buying into) some part of American's network, what will happen is that the competitors' lending costs will increase while American's will decrease.
Expect American to follow the US Air / United / Delta / NWA model in less than 12 months.
American is NOT looking to merge. CNBC is calling for a trans border merger, but it is illegal under current law. American has a large enough network to compete with American and UCAL.
keep in mind that AMERICAN owns the Debt on all the Eagle regional jets as well as their oWn MAinliners.. That HAS to be costing American a Damn LOT to cover if Eagle isn'treally pulling their Financial weight as
Arpey claimed.
12-03-2011, 02:57 PM
#298
Banned
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,822
Originally Posted by strfyr51
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keep in mind that AMERICAN owns the Debt on all the Eagle regional jets as well as their oWn MAinliners.. That HAS to be costing American a Damn LOT to cover if Eagle isn'treally pulling their Financial weight as
Arpey claimed.
keep in mind that AMERICAN owns the Debt on all the Eagle regional jets as well as their oWn MAinliners.. That HAS to be costing American a Damn LOT to cover if Eagle isn'treally pulling their Financial weight as
Arpey claimed.
Wait....what? AMR just xfered all our aircraft over to the mainline certificate for the "spin off" so Eagle would be on its own debt free. I don't know about NOT pulling any financial weight since we are owned by the same share holders.
12-04-2011, 03:47 AM
#300
Feeling blessed.
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: Was I finally in the right place at the right time?
Posts: 537
Originally Posted by iaflyer
"Benefit" is a strong word - AMR bought the assets, routes and the employees. Used those assets wisely? Not so much. Where are the benefits from Air Cal, Reno Air and TWA?
Sure, a competitor was removed but that was about it. Costly way of doing business.
Sure, a competitor was removed but that was about it. Costly way of doing business.
I think it's a "Crandallism" to say that "market share automatically leads to profitability." Under his tutelage, he would go head to head with smaller carriers in smaller markets just to drive them out of business. Selling fares below cost. (Virgin America is doing it as we speak out of DFW.) I also believe he thought it wise, and maybe the numbers showed it at the time, that by buying up smaller carriers, like the ones you mentioned, that you could reduce the total seats available and at the same time control the pricing power of that market. It was further exemplified by the multiple hub system he built up over the years. SJC, BNA and RDU were built up, then largely abandoned, except for code share, while AMR still controlled the gates. For a short while I lived in the RDU area, and I remember flying into BNA after the pull out. The AMR gates were a ghost town, while the rest of the airports was hopping.
You might say that Crandall built up expectations over his years at the head of AMR. Unions negotiated under those expectations and so did management. When they haven't come to pass, the "survivors" are left holding the bag. The TWA acquisition timed with 9/11 was a knock-down combination that's also greatly contributed. Obviously, the long-term strategy hasn't worked out so well.
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