Views on the pilot slowdown from FF customer
10-04-2012, 06:32 PM
#131
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Position: Baja Vermont
Posts: 5,178
Originally Posted by Hacker15e
Eh?
Nice idea, but no. Regardless of how "poor" CRM might exist in a flight of two, leaving your formation is a CRM foul that is inexcusable and tops whatever else might be going on to inspire it.
Nice idea, but no. Regardless of how "poor" CRM might exist in a flight of two, leaving your formation is a CRM foul that is inexcusable and tops whatever else might be going on to inspire it.
or /sarcasm/GF
10-04-2012, 06:35 PM
#133
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Originally Posted by Turbine26
You haven't kept up with the thread, I've said many commuter pilots work a whole lot harder and for a whole lot less pay than these 121 guys and in a commuter your not pushing buttons, some do mostly hand flying. So in your case you may be way under paid for what you do and fly. The button pushers, no.
10-04-2012, 06:40 PM
#134
HOSED BY PBS AGAIN
Joined APC: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,713
A couple of weeks ago I was flying through ORD. We were taxiing out around 2130 for our departure to EWR when an interesting exchange erupted over the ground frequency. Went something like this:
Aircraft 1: Hey ground, any reason American is taxiing so slow? Aircraft 2: are you serious? Where have you been lately?
Aircraft 1: well we're running low on gas because of him and may need to go back to the gate!
Aircraft 2: you're kidding, right? You have 30 planes in front of you and you seriously think you're getting right out?
ATC laughing: THAT is why I put you behind American! continue following American unless you'd rather go back to the gate and start all over!
Pretty funny....you could sense the humor that night. And no, their wasn't any hurry to go anywhere as it was a LONG taxi line.....and the pax are happy as long as you're moving, regardless of how fast. Good luck guys!
Aircraft 1: Hey ground, any reason American is taxiing so slow? Aircraft 2: are you serious? Where have you been lately?
Aircraft 1: well we're running low on gas because of him and may need to go back to the gate!
Aircraft 2: you're kidding, right? You have 30 planes in front of you and you seriously think you're getting right out?
ATC laughing: THAT is why I put you behind American! continue following American unless you'd rather go back to the gate and start all over!
Pretty funny....you could sense the humor that night. And no, their wasn't any hurry to go anywhere as it was a LONG taxi line.....and the pax are happy as long as you're moving, regardless of how fast. Good luck guys!
10-04-2012, 07:02 PM
#135
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Originally Posted by Turbine26
Its is $$$ but so is a new 787. The 60's ATC technology is rapidly changing, facilities combining, STARS, digital comm instead of AM, VOR going away, ADS. WIll the FAA drag its feet, yeah, they always do and that agency is being forced to change big time or it will be gone also. No one thought we'd be having AF pilots flying UAV's from 12,000 miles away or pilot less a/c land on a aircraft carrier at night, just too difficult and too many variables, it simply would never happen. Change has never happened faster than what it is now.
10-04-2012, 07:06 PM
#136
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: A-320/A
Posts: 588
Originally Posted by Turbine26
Percent of above statement that is likely true.......0
No thanks from me, get your ego fix in the cockpit while you still have a job there.
No thanks from me, get your ego fix in the cockpit while you still have a job there.
10-04-2012, 07:10 PM
#137
Eats shoots and leaves...
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: Didactic Synthetic Aviation Experience Provider
Posts: 849
Originally Posted by Turbine26
Yes a pilot 30 years, 2 Master's related to R&D, a career with a Federal agency and now with a Federal contractor now with a clearance you've never seen. Doing things that save lives of those overseas so you can kiss my ass with your egotistical anti-military BS.
You can now thank me for making things happen and being apart of just maybe what you didn't have the skills or vision to do Which is what makes you perfect at what you do, push buttons until replaced and all 5 of your stripes have to be retired.
You can now thank me for making things happen and being apart of just maybe what you didn't have the skills or vision to do Which is what makes you perfect at what you do, push buttons until replaced and all 5 of your stripes have to be retired.
Assuming there is any legitimacy to your claims (questionable at best), and if this "federal agency" was the FAA as was alleged earlier - responses such as these would be the reason so many pilots have such a deep disdain for a certain element of said agency. They are clueless morons who only know how to push papers and run a desk with ZERO clue about how to actually operate a flight safely. But they can sure keep busy determining of the candy in the life rafts is past it's expiration date. By no means are all of them that way, but there certainly are some. Usually the ones with little or no actual operating experience.
Unless your "clearance we've never seen" involves line flying, and since it's clear your "pilot 30 years" clearly hasn't involved any; why don't you go back to sorting your paperclips and listen to the adults who actually safely move the people and products day in and day out speak about what they know about (and you don't). You're embarrassing yourself (I point that out since you obviously can't see it).
We're all very impressed with whatever it is you do that you can't tell us about. Please, tell us more about what it is that you do that we can't know about but you can brag about, but only if you don't tell us what it is you're bragging about - it's fascinating! One time I did this thing, and nobody knew about it, and I didn't tell anyone, so no one ever talked about it because they didn't know. Clearly have a lot of common ground here, perhaps we even know some of the same people - but of course we can't tell them! We should get together sometime and not have lunch so we can not swap stories about things we can't talk about. It would be a fun afternoon.
10-04-2012, 07:34 PM
#138
Kerbal Rocket Surgeon
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: DTW 717A
Posts: 1,099
Originally Posted by Turbine26
You haven't kept up with the thread, I've said many commuter pilots work a whole lot harder and for a whole lot less pay than these 121 guys and in a commuter your not pushing buttons, some do mostly hand flying. So in your case you may be way under paid for what you do and fly. The button pushers, no.
And yes, i've done more than my share of "hand flying".
10-04-2012, 07:53 PM
#139
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 328
Originally Posted by bcrosier
Got shot down in the interviews I'm guessing.
Assuming there is any legitimacy to your claims (questionable at best), and if this "federal agency" was the FAA as was alleged earlier - responses such as these would be the reason so many pilots have such a deep disdain for a certain element of said agency. They are clueless morons who only know how to push papers and run a desk with ZERO clue about how to actually operate a flight safely. But they can sure keep busy determining of the candy in the life rafts is past it's expiration date. By no means are all of them that way, but there certainly are some. Usually the ones with little or no actual operating experience.
Unless your "clearance we've never seen" involves line flying, and since it's clear your "pilot 30 years" clearly hasn't involved any; why don't you go back to sorting your paperclips and listen to the adults who actually safely move the people and products day in and day out speak about what they know about (and you don't). You're embarrassing yourself (I point that out since you obviously can't see it).
We're all very impressed with whatever it is you do that you can't tell us about. Please, tell us more about what it is that you do that we can't know about but you can brag about, but only if you don't tell us what it is you're bragging about - it's fascinating! One time I did this thing, and nobody knew about it, and I didn't tell anyone, so no one ever talked about it because they didn't know. Clearly have a lot of common ground here, perhaps we even know some of the same people - but of course we can't tell them! We should get together sometime and not have lunch so we can not swap stories about things we can't talk about. It would be a fun afternoon.
Assuming there is any legitimacy to your claims (questionable at best), and if this "federal agency" was the FAA as was alleged earlier - responses such as these would be the reason so many pilots have such a deep disdain for a certain element of said agency. They are clueless morons who only know how to push papers and run a desk with ZERO clue about how to actually operate a flight safely. But they can sure keep busy determining of the candy in the life rafts is past it's expiration date. By no means are all of them that way, but there certainly are some. Usually the ones with little or no actual operating experience.
Unless your "clearance we've never seen" involves line flying, and since it's clear your "pilot 30 years" clearly hasn't involved any; why don't you go back to sorting your paperclips and listen to the adults who actually safely move the people and products day in and day out speak about what they know about (and you don't). You're embarrassing yourself (I point that out since you obviously can't see it).
We're all very impressed with whatever it is you do that you can't tell us about. Please, tell us more about what it is that you do that we can't know about but you can brag about, but only if you don't tell us what it is you're bragging about - it's fascinating! One time I did this thing, and nobody knew about it, and I didn't tell anyone, so no one ever talked about it because they didn't know. Clearly have a lot of common ground here, perhaps we even know some of the same people - but of course we can't tell them! We should get together sometime and not have lunch so we can not swap stories about things we can't talk about. It would be a fun afternoon.
To paraphrase "Jungle" who posts here frequently....
The people in the know don't talk about it....
The "wanna be's" brag about it...
As a reader....you'll have to decide who speaks the truth.
10-04-2012, 09:21 PM
#140
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: 767A (Ret)
Posts: 6,248
Not that there's anything wrong with it, you understand, but Turbine 26 is a former ATC controller, as he told us in this 2008 post:
Originally Posted by Turbine26
"We'll gladly stop to accomadate you"? No you wont, the capt will call the atc facility and complain someone was getting preferential service. AAL does have the slowest taxi rate in the industry and also the highest complainers rate to atc. AAL gives atc problems almost anywhere they fly with the slow taxi speeds, complaining when we let someone go past you, wanting to push when you don't have your #'s, or we'll have our #'s when we get to the end as you slow ever more and still don't have your #'s. Other airlines wonder why atc just doesn't always put AAL at the back instead of letting them be a roadblock. The reason we don't is AAL thinks they are doing nothing wrong and are the 1st to complain about their "perceived preferential teatment" which means paperwork, pulling tapes, talking to the controllers involved. There is no one outside AAL that doesn't think they are the slowest in the industry.
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