lolwut

I know this makes sense when you first read it... but, logically speaking, why?

All I can think is that if you want it, you should bid it before someone else on another list decides to and it goes more senior. Other than that, if you don't want it, why would it matter? You're going to be the same spot on the seniority list, same doh, same percentage, coming to the SLI with the same airline. Your individual position doesn't really matter.

Doctor

This might be true if you were captain before the snapshot of the seniority lists was taken.

Saabs

Absolutely not true in Bloch's most recent ISL done. Nobody jumped anybody else on their own list. ESPECIALLY at the mainline level where we have career FO's.

drinksonme

Is your logic that if you are a 190 CA, but can't hold CA on any other piece of equipment, that you will be suddenly higher on the seniority list after ISL? Or be able to bid CA on different aircraft cause your a CA as a result of ISL? If that's the case it's very flawed thinking. Yes, after ISL you will still be a CA....on the 190 since there will not be a "bump and flush" as a result, BUT you will still not be senior enough to hold CA on any other equipment. You will also still be junior CA, and if JCBA improves pay for 190 CA's, might be stuck in the same position for years unless you want to bid back to FO on another aircraft. Or you can be junior CA for years to then move to junior CA on another aircraft, but that again that could be years. Why would you be junior on RSV to then be junior and on deep RSV again. That sounds painful and not worth it since FO's on other equipment are making close to 190 CA's. Being a junior 190 CA (speaking relatively) does not automatically vault anyone up the list.

Trogdor

Why?

I'm a 757/767 FO with roughly 15 guys junior to me flying as 190 CAs. Are you suggesting they will fair better in the integration than I will? Obviously I could hold 190 CA but to me it's not worth the additional few bucks per hour and a commute to PHL.

What matters in an SLI is the number of Captain slots, not who holds them.

flybywire44

The arbitrators may likely compare what individual pilot system wide seniority can hold.

I think this is more plausible.

lolwut

So then wouldn't it be in everyone's interest to not bid captain? And push it even farther junior?

flybywire44

I don't think bidding captain is ever a bad thing. E190 captain in particular is a junior aircraft. I don't see APA stressing over protecting this class of pilots.

cactusmike

That's absolutely correct.

What you hold has no real bearing on where you will fall in the SLI. It's the positions that are accounted for by the arbitrators that count. If airline A has 500 group 1 captains and airline B has 250 group 1 captains then the ratio will be 2 A to 1 B. it odesnt matter if you could hold G1 captain but you are a group 3 F/O, those slots will be used to set up the list.

It's great that those E190 slots are going unfilled. That means more leverage in negotiations to increase the pay. The downside of bidding that spot is you are going to be a junior captain for a long time. We had that in PHX on the 757. We had 7 year guys holding captain on that jet because they were on reserve and would not fly. Everyone else senior to them bid 320 or 737 captain and held a line. You will make less money on reserve than a lineholder. Even now, if I bid back to the 757 I will be on reserve half the year. I can make more money as a group 2 lineholder than a group 3 reserve.

workingforfree

Would it be bad or good for a new hire to take these if given a chance?