APA SLI Proposed List
06-20-2015, 10:31 AM
#31
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,293
Originally Posted by SewerPipeDvr
They cannot do that. They must consider all factors. The "fix" is the weight they assign to different factors. That is why I think AMR's Chapter 11 will be different from USAir's ( to be clear, their previous Chapter 11 will not factor in this merger, only their current fiscal condition). The weight given the circumstances. AMR had about 5 or 6 billion in the bank. I think that is why your former SLI became such a disaster. The East refused to accept the weight given to their position. This being a Federal US Statute arbitration, a repeat won't be happening. It will be "it is as it is". Unless the East or West videotapes APA giving BJs to the arbitrators under the table.
The merger changed that. It changed things for us. On the date of the merger it put us all on the same economic footing.
We'll see, not making predictions.
06-20-2015, 10:39 AM
#32
Are we there yet??!!
Joined APC: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,010
APA .... 5:1 are you kidding me?
USAPA..3:1 more realistic since that is the approx ratio of airplanes.
West ... ?? some kind of modified Nic list. Very lopsided, almost as bad as APA proposal.
When this puppy goes before the arbitrators, I am hoping they give the East (and West) some credit for the massive amounts of retirements the East is supposed to have in the next 6-8 years. IE, moving halfway up the seniority list in that amount of time.
USAPA..3:1 more realistic since that is the approx ratio of airplanes.
West ... ?? some kind of modified Nic list. Very lopsided, almost as bad as APA proposal.
When this puppy goes before the arbitrators, I am hoping they give the East (and West) some credit for the massive amounts of retirements the East is supposed to have in the next 6-8 years. IE, moving halfway up the seniority list in that amount of time.
06-20-2015, 10:54 AM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 220
Originally Posted by Thedude
APA .... 5:1 are you kidding me?
USAPA..3:1 more realistic since that is the approx ratio of airplanes.
West ... ?? some kind of modified Nic list. Very lopsided, almost as bad as APA proposal.
USAPA..3:1 more realistic since that is the approx ratio of airplanes.
West ... ?? some kind of modified Nic list. Very lopsided, almost as bad as APA proposal.
To anybody other than an American or US East pilot -- say, an arbitrator, for example -- the West proposal actually looks the most balanced.
In the US/PI merger, the US side used PI's greed-grab in the previous PI/UR merger against them very successfully.
In the US/AW merger, the tables were turned, when the US moon-shot was thrown back into their faces by Mr. Nicolau (who had strongly suggested to them that might want to modify their proposal; a suggestion that was foolishly ignored).
It appears that the West Merger Committee has done its homework.
06-20-2015, 11:23 AM
#34
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Joined APC: Jan 2007
Posts: 405
Originally Posted by eaglefly
Among extremely questionable positions is their belief that pilots who flew for regionals deserve no credit on longevity at those carriers as they don't consider that acceptable "sweat equity".
flow-throughs from Eagle whose efforts contributing directly there as a wholly-owned carrier for 20-25 years that helped make AA what it is, is absurd.
flow-throughs from Eagle whose efforts contributing directly there as a wholly-owned carrier for 20-25 years that helped make AA what it is, is absurd.
06-20-2015, 11:31 AM
#35
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Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,838
Originally Posted by teddyballgame
To anybody other than an American or US East pilot -- say, an arbitrator, for example -- the West proposal actually looks the most balanced.
In the US/PI merger, the US side used PI's greed-grab in the previous PI/UR merger against them very successfully.
In the US/PI merger, the US side used PI's greed-grab in the previous PI/UR merger against them very successfully.
The Merger with US/PI was pure DOH with the exception of a Fence on the Piedmont 767 since USAir didn't have any wide bodies at the time of the merger. The Arbitrator agreed.
BTW many Junior PI FO's lost 2 months seniority due the fact that at Piedmont a new FO didn't get a Seniority Number until he/she completed Training, where his/her Counterpart who started training at USAir got a Seniority # from day one, yet they were both technically hired on the same day.
No dog in your fight, but when I hear comments like this it needs clarification.
06-20-2015, 11:42 AM
#36
Not retiring avatar
Joined APC: Apr 2010
Position: 777 CAP
Posts: 768
Try not to hang your hat on airline financials. As in our UA/CO merger we each had an expert that demonstrated why one airline was awesome and the other was in serious trouble. In the final award the arbitrators gave some lip service to our strengths and weaknesses, however, the net effect was zero.
Is there a public site that has the proposals posted?
Is there a public site that has the proposals posted?
06-20-2015, 01:44 PM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: A320 Capt
Posts: 5,293
Originally Posted by teddyballgame
To anybody other than an American or US East pilot -- say, an arbitrator, for example -- the West proposal actually looks the most balanced.
In the US/PI merger, the US side used PI's greed-grab in the previous PI/UR merger against them very successfully.
In the US/AW merger, the tables were turned, when the US moon-shot was thrown back into their faces by Mr. Nicolau (who had strongly suggested to them that might want to modify their proposal; a suggestion that was foolishly ignored).
It appears that the West Merger Committee has done its homework.
In the US/PI merger, the US side used PI's greed-grab in the previous PI/UR merger against them very successfully.
In the US/AW merger, the tables were turned, when the US moon-shot was thrown back into their faces by Mr. Nicolau (who had strongly suggested to them that might want to modify their proposal; a suggestion that was foolishly ignored).
It appears that the West Merger Committee has done its homework.
Are you the east guy that quit and went to AWA late in the game? It would explain a lot.
06-20-2015, 03:04 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Posts: 375
Originally Posted by Sliceback
Since that's the approx. ratio difference in w/b a/c, and is the top of the food chain, why wouldn't 5:1 be reasonable?
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