I have presented several strategies directly to the EXCO over the years, one of which was used and nearly resulted in the firing of one of our pilots. The other strategies were deemed far too extreme, which I understood, but at the same time it's unfortunate. I won't hesitate to offer new ideas in the future and I support our EXCO specifically. I disagree that attrition is an effective strategy right now because it leaves the ball in their court to do whatever they need to mitigate it. Again, they could just re-alocate crew as contracts expire, or partially farm contracts out or cancel them, not seek business that would tax their Amazon/DHL operations too heavily, 767 staffing is fat leaving opportunities for efficiency gains partially negating this strategy, they are still mostly filling classes, etc... Its a closed end strategy for our side and that's what makes it weak because they have options to deal with it. They do not have immediate options to deal with parking jets. The execs seem to have thrown the keys out the window per se, so how do you deal with a group who doesn't seem to care either way? They will always get theirs...

 

Why is Atlas like a flight school for UPS? Seems like most of UPS' newhire classes are made up of 1/4 to 1/3 Atlas pilots.

 

What airlines do Atlas pilots consider their peers for the purpose of contract comparisons?

 

Thank you for stepping up to the plate and trying to make a difference. There are too many pilots here that do nothing but complain. Trying and failing or even partially succeeding if far better than giving up and doing nothing.

Personally, I, too, am in favor of extreme strategies, and there may still be a time for them in the future ...

As I pointed out, the attrition thing is only a part of the union's strategy. There are several other irons in the fire some of which I think most folks know about and some of which none of us know about.

Flynn and his team are all about growth. It has been their strategy for the entire time that I have been here and it is working well for them. Due to our size, Atlas now has the economy of scale and the critical mass to survive in an industry that has crushed Evergreen, World, North American, ATA, etc. So, for them to give up on growth seems antithetical to their current strategy. Atlas is the 800 pound gorilla in the room and they are redefining the industry with their vast array of customers, their fleet, their Titan portfolio, and the whole CMI thing.

Of course, they may just sell some or all of Atlas to Amazon and retire to the country club for some much needed R&R.

 

According to the pilot group, it's FedEx, UPS, Delta, American, and United.

Management will argue that Atlas is no FedEx, but when I am flying FedEx freight in a 747 from a FedEx hub to another FedEx hub using a FedEx call sign, it's pretty hard to say we do something less than what FedEx pilots do. And as the carrier of a significant part of DHL and Amazon freight, I'd say that Atlas pilots are on the leading edge of the primary competition to FedEx and UPS. Of course, not yet mentioned is the array of oddball military, specialized (Dreamlifter), and off the grid flying that we do into places you have to find with Google Earth!

According to Atlas management, it's Southern, Omni, and ATI.

 

Regional pilots have been saying basically the same thing for years, and yet, they don't get paid near what a major pilot does.

Friends at UPS tell me that they are hiring Atlas guys in droves, so it seems that those former Atlas pilots don't consider Atlas peers with UPS or they would have stayed for the new contract.

 

Why would anyone with an offer on the table from UPS stay at Atlas with just the hope of a new contract being the deciding factor? That has nothing to do with whether they are peers or not.

Did you just compare Atlas to a regional? From where I sit on the outside, Atlas pilots should not only make what UPS/FedEx pilots make..... they should make more.

 

More? Why?

Not to sound arrogant, but Atlas is a contractor and hauls stuff for UPS and FedEx during the holidays. What you said is like saying that regional pilots should be paid more than legacy pilots because they fly harder trips.

 

Here he is yet again.....Knotsee is the same fool that keeps reappearing in various guises trying to troll this place into the same end that Flightinfo took. His patterns and responses are exactly the same every time. Mods....please take care of this ass clown yet again.

 

Actually, what I expect is for the new Atlas pilots, at least for the few months that they here at Atlas, to see the big picture and understand what is going on. And all of them do understand. But, apparently you don’t. I’ll use simple words because you seem to have trouble grasping the subtle messages from the union, you know, the ATAM’s, the chairman’s messages, the P2P messages, the emails, etc., etc.

BOOT means Block Out On Time. This takes away any advantage the company may get by aircraft departing early.
SHOP means Stop Helping Out Purchase (Purchase, New York is where Atlas HQ is).
Then there is a grassroots movement to educate pilots about what a poor decision outbasing is because you are flying 31 days in a row with only the minimum legal breaks for straight pay. No premium pay there. You are,literally doing the work of two pilots in one month.
There is also the grassroots movement to educate pilots about picking up open time trips which also serves to help management by reducing their staffing problems.
An extension of these last two pilot initiated movements is the education of potential Atlas new hires. Some of our pilots have actually gone to airline job fairs and distributed information sheets to job seekers that explain the low first year pay, the law suits that the company has filed against the pilot group, the persistent contractual violations, and many other facts that they need to know in order to make an informed decision about whether or not to apply at Atlas.

All of these union and pilot group initiatives are designed to bring pressure on the company to actively perform at the negotiating table. So when people get on the message boards and crow about what a cool place Atlas is, it doesn’t help out that strategy which affects the entire pilot group - not just “the old guard”. It would help you out, too, by the way if you thought it out.

Or perhaps your intention is not to stay and you don’t give a squat about our pilot group. It seems that you even have quite a bit of distain for “the old guard”, you know, the ones that paved the way for you. You may want to rethink this last position when you land your dream job at American. All of the majors have pretty strong unions and you will be expected to understand and contribute positively to their efforts. You may be able to slide along whistling your own tune for the little time you’re here at Atlas, but after a while, whether it is here or at a major, you’ll need to man up and be a team player or you will continue to have “painful trips across the Pacific”.

And when you say “As hard as this is for you to stomach, it is infinitely better than a regional” that is your opinion, not a fact. I spent six years at a regional and in many ways, that regional’s work rules were better than they are here at Atlas.

What it really comes down to is knowing what your true professional worth is. Would you accept a job flying a heavy jet if a company paid captains $200 an hour? How about $150? How about $140?

Atlas pays $137 an hour for a 767 captain. That’s barely $16 an hour more than a regional airline captains pay. That’s “infinitely better”? Atlas first year pay is less than most regional pilots first year pay. That’s “infinitely better”? Atlas doesn’t pay sick days until you drop down to min guarantee. That’s “infinitely better”? Regional min guarantee is 75 hours. At Atlas it’s 62. That’s “infinitely better”? At Atlas, we lose money in every month that we have training, vacation, or are sick. That’s “infinitely better”? We pilots are the defendants in TWO lawsuits that our company has filed against us. That’s “infinitely better”?

These things are all true. They are not lies and if you think that the vast majority of the pilot group and the union are spreading lies, you will indeed have many more “painful trips across the Pacific”.

The only positive career move a regional pilot would get here is a type rating. Everybody understands that. And every other regional pilot that is here for the type also contributes to the cause as long as they are here.

Maybe you should think about doing the same.

Hope this clears things up for you.

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