Guys, I am not so sure why this is any different than a guy that jumpseats to work for a Regional or a Major airline...commuting days do not count in your commitment to the company. (Of course, there are several airlines like Omni, Southern, etc that are "home-based" where the minute you leave home, you are on Day 1 vs like at Atlas we may be on Day 0).

I get that it may even be two days before an assignment, but that is a choice in some cases of where you live and where you are based. Being a new guy of course complicates it because you don't have the seniority to hold a closer base, but for most guys that have been here even a year or so, Day 0 commutes are self-induced by way of base selection, and your Gateway Airport location.

On the money. In my prior life I was traveling via jump seat all the time to and from work on my day off. The difference now is that I'm on a ticket and the onus is on the company rather than me to make it. THAT is a very good thing! If I never jump seat again in my life I will be an extremely happy man.

You don't get it because you haven't done it.

When, in a previous life, I was commuting the only requirement was to show up rested by check in. Which I did religiously.

Here, since they buy you a ticket they FORCE you to rest (even longer than if they DH you in the middle of a trip), which could necessitate leaving the house a full day earlier than you would if you were jumpseating. So, in essence, they are controlling your off days and hours you need to arrive in your base prior.

This is a job. I show up to make them money. They own all of my time for the contacted work period. My side of the deal is I get paid and time off.

And people wonder why there's a mob with pitchforks and torches.

"I don't get it?"...wow, okay.

What you seem to ignore in your rant above is that accepting a ticket to your base is absolutely voluntary...and you are most welcome to do it the same way as you did in a former life. (Jumpseat and show up just prior to report time.)

But since I did not have a former life, I wouldn't know that, right?!!

And the "mob with pitchforks and torches" comment is hardly necessary...we are all professionals. Let us at least be civil in the discourse.

Nope. Gateway is from your gateway airport to your assigned crew base ONLY. Anything else is DH.

It's a significant distinction - for Gateway, you are subject to imputed income and may have to leave home on a day off. A DH (flying from home to anywhere except your crew base) isn't subject to taxation and you don't have to leave home prior to when AIMS shows you leaving JFK (in your case).

Home.......hmmmmm????? Isn't there where you would spend at least half of your time?

Let's see....12x17=204, plus lets say 3 gateways per 60 day line = 18, plus let's say you're junior and can't conflict your training days (which if you did by the way you get paid less than you normally would on a "day on") so 6 days plus 2 travel on the front end for sure...8, so there is 230 days a year right there...leaves you 135 days out of 365 to be with your family and kids, outside activities, hobbies, friends...maybe a few more than that if you are able to bid vacation to conflict with your bid...but then they cheat you on credits there as well.
Oh...guys that jumpseat usually only work 12-16 days a month.
Home reserve...or what most airlines would call long call...sorry...no pay for you.

AMENDMENT: Apologies to Cliff, you can be assigned Gateway travel from home to somewhere besides your crew base BUT the rules are different, which is the point I wanted to make. You can't report for duty at the other location any earlier than if you had been put on an actual DH from base and received rest (if required). On the 767 based in JFK, I never had to leave home prior to my trip beginning in AIMS, and it was never taxed, whereas I was taxed for anything that touched JFK.

Source: CBAG page 13

Thanks to Galaxydriver for challenging me on this. Expeditious travel and 20-hour rules still apply.

I regret it becuase I could have built the flight time needed to not eat **** at a Regional. Other than that its terrible. The long flights (and I mean LONG FLIGHTS), the not being able to maintain landing currency, the lack of manipulating the controls, the flying into crazy ass countries and flying in complete danger zones for which you are not compenstated for (at least not while I was there). The management not giving three ****s for the pilot group or any group for that matter. But by far its the being away for so long. When you are gone you are gone man......They will keep you out forever!!! Your wife and children WILL forget who you are!!! Its a laundry list man. I only regret it because I didnt get the experience required for me to get something better than what Im faced with now.... ;( If you like all of the crap I listed above than I'm sure you guys can enjoy it there.

I am likely one of the last guys on this planet to defend our current conditions and our current CBA...but it is certainly better than what you are saying above, and what you may have experienced during your tenure here.

Are you sure your frustrations are not misplaced?...I agree that the CBA in 2003 was our first one, and woefully inadequate (heck, the current one is mostly made of Swiss cheese), but a lot of guys stuck it out, and built time in the airplanes (744 and 747 Classic) until they felt they had landed a better gig.

However, if you left on good terms from Atlas, there may be a way to get back here, if that is something you wish to pursue. Just a thought?!!

Good luck.

I did leave on good terms, actually great terms. I was with Atlas prior at a MX capacity so all in all I have been around Atlas since 1997. Back when Chowdry was still alive. I have thought about coming back but I'm just not sure. I hear the process is not what it was back when I got on. I was hired in 1999 as a F/E on the classic and upgraded to FO a year after. The interview was quite simple and the whacko test was also simple. I now hear you have to have come off the Space Shuttle in order to get back on....LOL. I do know many many great Captains that will recommend me but I am told that does not bypass the crazy phone and online test being administered. It would be nice if I could get a formal reaquaintance interview, shake some hands and get a class date....LOL ;)) We'll see what happens. I have a few guys checking in on this for me. Thanks for the luck wishes....I sure the heck need them!!!