Did the idea of an independent union ever float by? I dont understand why its always Teamsters or ALPA in a majority of arguments (same giant douche vs turd sandwich at 5Y as well BTW) while some of the independent unions are very transparent and powerful, ie. IPA, APA, SWAPA. Maybe K4 doesnt have the numbers to fund a independent venture? Hope you guys can get a high turnout.

CaptainHvac,
Yes the size of the K4 pilot group does not make it feasible to have an in-house union. We will also be looking forward giving ALPA another cargo carrier opposed to ending cargo cut out and adopting FAR 117 such as 1224 and IPA want.

After much analysis and discussion, the MEC has c
oncluded that a joint e
ffort by the Company
and the MEC has the potential to positively impa
ct the outcome of both our collective bargaining
and the ongoing FAA rule discussions. Accordi
ngly, we ask that FedEx Express oppose the
cargo cutout and we request that FedEx management join with ALPA to cooperatively and
publicly seek a rule that applies consistently to
all carriers and one that provides “one level of
safety” for the conduct of air transportation w
ith respect to Flight
Time and Duty Time
regulation. I look forward to your
reply on this time-sensitive issue

As you already know the window to vote opens tomorrow, putting the DW fiasco aside there are a couple of reasons to stay with 1224, but there are many more reasons to leave. What we need to understand is Atlas and Kalitta are competitors, and I know a lot of guys don’t like to hear it but it’s the truth. Atlas has 4-times as many pilots as Kalitta and therefore has a control of our union. We received a brilliantly written letter from Teamsters yesterday, and if I lived in utopia it just might persuade me to reconsider my vote. But we don’t live in utopia, and we need to be realistic and understand that having a competitor control our destiny is ludicrous.

No one that I know at Kalitta holds any ill will toward the pilots at Atlas, and we all hope you are able to secure a contract soon. This move should not be perceived as Kalitta dumping on Atlas because it is not about that. I believe this movement was started to allow Kalitta pilots to negotiate without any intervention from an outside source. I know our previous Executive Council signed an agreement to have DW sign off on our contract before we could vote on it, but this was counter productive to our best interest. Moving forward it’s in our best interest to control our future and the way to do this is a vote for ALPA.

If you feel that having competitors at one Union is bad for your company, then why are DAL and UAL and Alaskan, and Hawaiian and Frontier and JetBlue and Spirit and Sun Country and Westjet and Air Transat +++++ all ALPA?
Why are all the plumbers in one area in the same Union? Same goes for electricians, etc., etc.
United, it is easier to fight against the 0.1%'s attempt to take ALL the money. That is why the 0.1% HATE unions.
Namaste...

Because when Delta is negotiating a contract they don't have to ask United if there proposals are ok with them - LIKE WE HAD TO

Points !!!

Competition should be between the management of the companies, not between the pilots. A true Union would strive to keep all,the pilots on a level playing field and working under the same pay and benefits.

Pushing away from this makes pilot unions weaker, not stronger. Hindsight being 20/20, a national seniority list and single union would have solved many of these issues today.

It's sad reading this thread because you have 3 great pilot groups, notice I didn't say airlines, I don't care for the airlines. It's the groups that matter. Anyway, you have three groups of pilots that all fly for the same company that pays the bills. "DHL". As a single group of pilots under one banner, there is more power there than you realize and here we sit watching one group willing to through that away.

Having come from a Union family and seeing how pilots make unions and associations work, you realize quick that pilots as a whole have no clue, absolutely zero, on how we should be working. Pretty pathetic. If a long shoreman realized what we do to each other, he would say you all might as well be management.

Easy to point fingers, but this wouldn’t even be happening right now if the 1224 E-Board and DW (mostly Atlas) just sat back, appreciated the huge gains we made, and at the last second didn’t stop everything over a stupid duty day demand. Now Omni is suffering this bull crap. Atlas will end up the only DHL carrier in 1224, and your union leadership will be the only ones to blame.
My sources tell me, that to this day, the E-board has members still ****ed off that we got our contract, that we stepped over them and went to Bourne. Why on earth would anyone at Kalitta want to enable these same dimwits to interfere with any future contracts?

And your answer is to go to a union that wants to get rid of the cargo cutout and have everyone under 117. It is something I support.