12 Hours flight time FAR question (FDX)

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08-11-2010, 06:08 AM

#11

TheBaron

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Aug 2007

Position: MD-11 FO

Posts: 608

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adlerdriver

Scenario:
3 man crew operating to South America scheduled for 9:08 block. Land short due to engine problem resulting in 4:32 of block so far. GOC wants to send us on to destination if aircraft is fixed. That flight is scheduled for 8:15 block. We say no because we're a 3 man crew and cannot go over 12 hours flight time.
Fedex DO says we can since we were originally scheduled to be under 12.
Does that sound right? I thought headwinds, holding etc. that causes over 12 is okay AFTER takeoff, assuming original schedule was good. Taking off on a second leg when you already know you're going to be over 12 - that doesn't pass the common sense test.
Ends up being moot because aircraft if hard down, but I'd like to know the real answer.
Thanks.

It can be even more twisted than you think. FedEx is authorized to use historical block times as the basis for manning a flight. I did ANC-HKG a few years ago and the historical was 10:??...I don't remember the exact number but legal for a 3 man crew. Our block time for the day, because of winds and a required route, were over 12 hours...printed right there on the release. All three of us were sure we needed another crew member. The D.O. and Joe came up with enough written documentation to prove otherwise. A more accurate naming of the Supplemental regulations would be Flexible Guidelines.

Last edited by TheBaron; 08-11-2010 at 08:39 AM.

08-11-2010, 07:46 AM

#12

bleedairpacks

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Jul 2009

Position: MD11 CA (rtd.)

Posts: 318

Quote:

Originally Posted by tennesseeflyboy

What a screwed up mess .......................... and I just heard that there is considerable effort to fly both Supplemental and Flag here ??? Another reason I cannot and will not do International flying here.

Hey, it's a paycheck!

08-11-2010, 09:01 AM

#13

Baja

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Feb 2009

Posts: 160

Quote:

Originally Posted by skypine27

..... In-flight is one thing, but after you have landed and are looking at new paperwork for the next leg, you can't block out if it adds up greater than the abv limits.

I have experienced such as case and discovered, to my surprise that I was given a release with a .85 plan that had truly bogus ground speeds embedded so as to create the fantasy of making destination within limits. It ignored ATC limits in the departure and arrival segments that would have been a factor time en route. This was an over water flight that would have depended on the flt plan to provide position report/estimates to ATC (prior to CPDLC). None of that was ever considered. Only the single minded focus of creating of a bogus block time that allowed completion of the trip. Ya'll be careful out there.