FDX MEC Minutes
07-09-2014, 04:26 AM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
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Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 556
FDX MEC Minutes
Looks like the micro management of the CBA process might be an issue? How can we get a deal if we keep having mini votes and withdrawn proposals? I am quite certain we would be not happy if the Company "withdrew" previously agreed to language.
Also please explain how a MEC Committee Chairman gets his training to occur in a base he is not in? Is that part of the double diamond premier executive gold elite Marriott program we buy that Committee in DCA ? Sign me up.
Note: Edited to remove names. See full minutes on ALPA site.
XX asked for clarification on the agenda items. XX provided clarification on the issues to be discussed and assured XX that the item that was of utmost concern to him and his domicile would be addressed.
XX addressed the MEC and briefed them on the Company’s proposal concerning the prior week’s negotiations with the Company and noted he had previously emailed the language to them.Discussion took place and the MEC was polled to determine their recommendation on a course ofaction for the Negotiating Committee with respect to Section 26. The votes were tallied, discussed and the Negotiating Committee acknowledged the MEC’s direction.
XX briefed on the second item from the previous week’s negotiations that required MEC input. Discussion took place and the MEC was polled to determine their recommendation on a course of action for the Negotiating Committee with respect to 777 jumpseats for deadheading.The MEC was polled. Additional discussion took place. The votes were tallied, a majority determined, and the Negotiating Committee acknowledged the MEC’s direction.
The Negotiating Committee briefed the MEC on previously agreed to contract language
that was accepted by FDX. After discussion the MEC determined to withdraw the language and continue to bargain on other sections of the contract
Also please explain how a MEC Committee Chairman gets his training to occur in a base he is not in? Is that part of the double diamond premier executive gold elite Marriott program we buy that Committee in DCA ? Sign me up.
Note: Edited to remove names. See full minutes on ALPA site.
XX asked for clarification on the agenda items. XX provided clarification on the issues to be discussed and assured XX that the item that was of utmost concern to him and his domicile would be addressed.
XX addressed the MEC and briefed them on the Company’s proposal concerning the prior week’s negotiations with the Company and noted he had previously emailed the language to them.Discussion took place and the MEC was polled to determine their recommendation on a course ofaction for the Negotiating Committee with respect to Section 26. The votes were tallied, discussed and the Negotiating Committee acknowledged the MEC’s direction.
XX briefed on the second item from the previous week’s negotiations that required MEC input. Discussion took place and the MEC was polled to determine their recommendation on a course of action for the Negotiating Committee with respect to 777 jumpseats for deadheading.The MEC was polled. Additional discussion took place. The votes were tallied, a majority determined, and the Negotiating Committee acknowledged the MEC’s direction.
The Negotiating Committee briefed the MEC on previously agreed to contract language
that was accepted by FDX. After discussion the MEC determined to withdraw the language and continue to bargain on other sections of the contract
07-09-2014, 06:45 AM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,931
I prefer oversight of the NC to make sure everyone is on the same page and negotiation fatigue is not a factor. We got stung with it in 2006 and 2007. Would like to avoid it this time.
We also don't know what kind of "stuff" FedEx attorneys are pulling at the table. I have no problem pulling items out that may have been agreed to in an effort to reach an overall compromise. IMHO management has soundly rebuffed those efforts. The longer this takes the more I want!!
You're really worried about where training is getting done? Seriously? What a red herring you're throwing out there.
We also don't know what kind of "stuff" FedEx attorneys are pulling at the table. I have no problem pulling items out that may have been agreed to in an effort to reach an overall compromise. IMHO management has soundly rebuffed those efforts. The longer this takes the more I want!!
You're really worried about where training is getting done? Seriously? What a red herring you're throwing out there.
07-09-2014, 02:28 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 556
Originally Posted by Gunter
I prefer oversight of the NC to make sure everyone is on the same page and negotiation fatigue is not a factor. We got stung with it in 2006 and 2007. Would like to avoid it this time.
We also don't know what kind of "stuff" FedEx attorneys are pulling at the table. I have no problem pulling items out that may have been agreed to in an effort to reach an overall compromise. IMHO management has soundly rebuffed those efforts. The longer this takes the more I want!!
You're really worried about where training is getting done? Seriously? What a red herring you're throwing out there.
We also don't know what kind of "stuff" FedEx attorneys are pulling at the table. I have no problem pulling items out that may have been agreed to in an effort to reach an overall compromise. IMHO management has soundly rebuffed those efforts. The longer this takes the more I want!!
You're really worried about where training is getting done? Seriously? What a red herring you're throwing out there.
Yes, I do worry about red herrings such as not following the CBA. I can't explain how a ANC based pilot can get CQ done in MEM without requisite training travel days, hotel, etc?
Someone else said if you want good deals then just jump in the pool and get yours. Well I prefer that we operate a tight ship and not give good deals. If someone is doing ALPA work because the benefits and perks are better than line flying then we are doing it wrong. In this case just have to do a little research and you can find out the money we spend on ONE guy to amass massive hotel perks when cheaper and more reasonable accommodations can easily be made. If the results were commensurate with expense that might be different but the Chair in question has not even updated the ALPA web page in almost 2 years yet has the 2nd highest budget......Just more DC pork.
07-11-2014, 09:14 AM
#6
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Joined APC: Jun 2006
Posts: 732
4a2b, There is nothing to see here in my opinion. ALPA has a very stringent Financial Oversight group made up of MEC Members. If any Committee is spending money that is not producing a value to the members I am personally confident that it will be dealt with appropriately.
Sometimes the work being done/produced is hard to measure and the lack of Member communication from a Chair does not mean they are not working and I am sure that in this case we are getting good value and representation from those ALPA flight pay, hotel, travel and per diem spent.
I suggest any concerns you have be addressed with the Financial Oversight Committee or your Block Rep.
Sometimes the work being done/produced is hard to measure and the lack of Member communication from a Chair does not mean they are not working and I am sure that in this case we are getting good value and representation from those ALPA flight pay, hotel, travel and per diem spent.
I suggest any concerns you have be addressed with the Financial Oversight Committee or your Block Rep.
07-11-2014, 10:27 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,931
4A,
I think you may be someone that doesn't volunteer and want to get more for your money. Nothing wrong with that, in theory, but I think you underestimate the work or overestimate the pay.
It's also possible you sit at the kitchen table and tell your wife you won't take a pay cut or put in those kind of hours to do union work as you're opening your pay stub in shock of how much goes to ALPA.
Most likely you got shot down for some union job and want to bring down the system because someone you dislike is running things.
Tell me I'm wrong. Be honest.
I think you may be someone that doesn't volunteer and want to get more for your money. Nothing wrong with that, in theory, but I think you underestimate the work or overestimate the pay.
It's also possible you sit at the kitchen table and tell your wife you won't take a pay cut or put in those kind of hours to do union work as you're opening your pay stub in shock of how much goes to ALPA.
Most likely you got shot down for some union job and want to bring down the system because someone you dislike is running things.
Tell me I'm wrong. Be honest.
Last edited by Gunter; 07-11-2014 at 10:44 AM.
07-11-2014, 02:47 PM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 556
Originally Posted by Gunter
4A,
I think you may be someone that doesn't volunteer and want to get more for your money. Nothing wrong with that, in theory, but I think you underestimate the work or overestimate the pay.
It's also possible you sit at the kitchen table and tell your wife you won't take a pay cut or put in those kind of hours to do union work as you're opening your pay stub in shock of how much goes to ALPA.
Most likely you got shot down for some union job and want to bring down the system because someone you dislike is running things.
Tell me I'm wrong. Be honest.
I think you may be someone that doesn't volunteer and want to get more for your money. Nothing wrong with that, in theory, but I think you underestimate the work or overestimate the pay.
It's also possible you sit at the kitchen table and tell your wife you won't take a pay cut or put in those kind of hours to do union work as you're opening your pay stub in shock of how much goes to ALPA.
Most likely you got shot down for some union job and want to bring down the system because someone you dislike is running things.
Tell me I'm wrong. Be honest.
You obviously spent lots of time reviewing my continuous posts that paint me in that jilted ALPA club wannabe. Why don't you review my posts and tell me if you think that I am a hater of the current admin or jealous, in anyway, of the sweet deals I am missing out on.
Maybe, just maybe, there are things that slip by the MEC and the Membership? I will be sure to have my concerns addressed properly in a more formal manner. Until then I will polish my resume up and see if I can fool someone over at Kirby Towers into giving me a cushy Union job where I collect international override for 100% of the trips I never fly nor have any visible work product or oversight.
07-11-2014, 04:44 PM
#10
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Joined APC: May 2006
Posts: 2,889
I did some of that ivory tower work…at Kirby as a block rep and later a committee guy (Legislative Affairs) and for a short stint at ALPA National. (President's Committee for Cargo…) In January I asked to step back from any/all formal positions, and here's why:
Its a *(^%$ lot of work and stress. You cannot escape it. It follows you home, it follows you into the AOC, into the cockpit, into your bedroom, into every thing that you do. At a certain point, you have a choice--embrace the challenge and dive in and let it roll over you, or step back. I was proud of stepping up the challenge, but I left because I hit a huge crossroad--my wife was running for office and my business was growing faster than I could successfully manage with the added issues associated with serving the pilot group. At a certain point I had to decide if supporting a wife who's had my back for 25 years was less important than battling ALPA National leadership to push our Cargo agenda forward, and I decided that while both are crucial the lady of my life was much more important. Someone else as or likely MORE capable than me could do the ALPA work, but I was the only one who could take on the other responsibilities.
Here's my question: If ALPA was such a lucrative gig, why would I step back and fly the line verses just stick with the "easy" Union work? The fact is union work takes up much, much more time than line flying did, at least for me. Nobody ever gets a 1/1 ratio of trip removal for day of work done. You may get removed from a long trip for a 1 day event, but you are going to make up those hours at a future date with union work or by flying AFB. Again--you can query the financial oversight folks if you want, but I am here to tell you that I made more on the line and with a lot less stress than I did scrambling from House office to House office on the Hill. Concur expense reports, trip removal forms, approval processes, and a host of bureaucratic BS only add to the ass pain of trying to do your job. Next, you will also have the 5-10% of the pilot group that snipe and complain about what you do/do not do correctly. You know that--but it does get old. You also have a group of guys who constantly want to run for office or against someone in office and are seeking support/alliances/recommendations, so there are office politics to navigate. Next, everything you do as a captain or as a fighter pilot you get to do with a certain amount of decisiveness and autonomy. As a union rep/committtee member, EVERY thing you do is weighted, discussed, reviewed, argued about, run past committee, and modified….so even if an idea was 100% yours to start by the end of the process its been stapled, mangled, and mutilated by a host of individuals before it sees daylight. Sound satisfying? Anyone who has done these jobs--committees, MEC work, volunteer, or whatever will tell you that in no way is it easier and or less time consuming than flying the line. Until you have spent hours on conference calls (not compensated), talking to constituents (not compensated), working with guys and gals at other carriers to get ideas (not compensated) you do not know what a huge time sink many of these projects become. You will spend hours, days, and weeks off the clock doing whatever it takes to try to make a difference.
When I am on the road with FedEx, my time out of the cockpit is my time. I can read, surf the net, work out, travel, go out to eat, etc all on my clock. When I was doing work at ALPA it was a whole lot more like doing my additional duties in the Air Force…including meetings, mandatory dinners (basically informal meetings), and hours of emails, briefings, and preparation for various events. Take a look at our guys who are doing committee work in issues like dangerous goods, flight time duty time battles, security, etc etc and you'll see faces of guys on CSPAN you know from the line. It takes a lot of time and effort to do that work and not look like a clown act, and most of the work is not done on trip removal…its done at your kitchen table or on your layovers or on your days off.
So--what do I say when I see the guys with these "cush" positions? Today, I said "Thank you" to the following folks: MEC chairman, vice chairman, Sec treasurer, two of the negotiating committee, and the head of our Dangerous Goods committee. All were jumpseating home after a week of meetings. Me? I was jumping out to meet my wife, where we are hosting a seminar for our business. We are also using our time together to work on some of her campaign issues. I can multi-task flying and some of these duties, but I found that ALPA work quickly overloaded my ability to do much besides ALPA work, so I retreated. If you think its easy, or you think its a boondoggle, I urge you to step up to any committee and start getting involved. I did it for 5 years, and I learned a ton about how important our union really is not only at FedEx but for the entire profession. I'm thrilled I got to participate. I did some good stuff, and gooned up some stuff too…I've posted on some of that previously. I didn't always see eye to eye with many whom I worked along side. But anyone who mans up and takes on this challenge deserves our respect, and our thanks. Right now, there are two teams. I long ago decided which team I wanted to support. Which team are you pulling for?
Its a *(^%$ lot of work and stress. You cannot escape it. It follows you home, it follows you into the AOC, into the cockpit, into your bedroom, into every thing that you do. At a certain point, you have a choice--embrace the challenge and dive in and let it roll over you, or step back. I was proud of stepping up the challenge, but I left because I hit a huge crossroad--my wife was running for office and my business was growing faster than I could successfully manage with the added issues associated with serving the pilot group. At a certain point I had to decide if supporting a wife who's had my back for 25 years was less important than battling ALPA National leadership to push our Cargo agenda forward, and I decided that while both are crucial the lady of my life was much more important. Someone else as or likely MORE capable than me could do the ALPA work, but I was the only one who could take on the other responsibilities.
Here's my question: If ALPA was such a lucrative gig, why would I step back and fly the line verses just stick with the "easy" Union work? The fact is union work takes up much, much more time than line flying did, at least for me. Nobody ever gets a 1/1 ratio of trip removal for day of work done. You may get removed from a long trip for a 1 day event, but you are going to make up those hours at a future date with union work or by flying AFB. Again--you can query the financial oversight folks if you want, but I am here to tell you that I made more on the line and with a lot less stress than I did scrambling from House office to House office on the Hill. Concur expense reports, trip removal forms, approval processes, and a host of bureaucratic BS only add to the ass pain of trying to do your job. Next, you will also have the 5-10% of the pilot group that snipe and complain about what you do/do not do correctly. You know that--but it does get old. You also have a group of guys who constantly want to run for office or against someone in office and are seeking support/alliances/recommendations, so there are office politics to navigate. Next, everything you do as a captain or as a fighter pilot you get to do with a certain amount of decisiveness and autonomy. As a union rep/committtee member, EVERY thing you do is weighted, discussed, reviewed, argued about, run past committee, and modified….so even if an idea was 100% yours to start by the end of the process its been stapled, mangled, and mutilated by a host of individuals before it sees daylight. Sound satisfying? Anyone who has done these jobs--committees, MEC work, volunteer, or whatever will tell you that in no way is it easier and or less time consuming than flying the line. Until you have spent hours on conference calls (not compensated), talking to constituents (not compensated), working with guys and gals at other carriers to get ideas (not compensated) you do not know what a huge time sink many of these projects become. You will spend hours, days, and weeks off the clock doing whatever it takes to try to make a difference.
When I am on the road with FedEx, my time out of the cockpit is my time. I can read, surf the net, work out, travel, go out to eat, etc all on my clock. When I was doing work at ALPA it was a whole lot more like doing my additional duties in the Air Force…including meetings, mandatory dinners (basically informal meetings), and hours of emails, briefings, and preparation for various events. Take a look at our guys who are doing committee work in issues like dangerous goods, flight time duty time battles, security, etc etc and you'll see faces of guys on CSPAN you know from the line. It takes a lot of time and effort to do that work and not look like a clown act, and most of the work is not done on trip removal…its done at your kitchen table or on your layovers or on your days off.
So--what do I say when I see the guys with these "cush" positions? Today, I said "Thank you" to the following folks: MEC chairman, vice chairman, Sec treasurer, two of the negotiating committee, and the head of our Dangerous Goods committee. All were jumpseating home after a week of meetings. Me? I was jumping out to meet my wife, where we are hosting a seminar for our business. We are also using our time together to work on some of her campaign issues. I can multi-task flying and some of these duties, but I found that ALPA work quickly overloaded my ability to do much besides ALPA work, so I retreated. If you think its easy, or you think its a boondoggle, I urge you to step up to any committee and start getting involved. I did it for 5 years, and I learned a ton about how important our union really is not only at FedEx but for the entire profession. I'm thrilled I got to participate. I did some good stuff, and gooned up some stuff too…I've posted on some of that previously. I didn't always see eye to eye with many whom I worked along side. But anyone who mans up and takes on this challenge deserves our respect, and our thanks. Right now, there are two teams. I long ago decided which team I wanted to support. Which team are you pulling for?
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