TED74

Thank goodness.

Mandatory retirements:
2019 - 425
2020 - 525
2021 - 725
2022 - 800

Time is on our side and we've got a decent PWA as it stands. Mandatory retirements will cause a QOL improvement for the vast majority of our pilots; in many cases the improvement will be significant. We need to get the new JVs right and haven't even exchanged openers. I'd be concerned if someone thought we'd have a final deal in 2019, and question the motivations of anyone who badly needed one so quickly.

crewdawg

^^^^What he said!


The Weird Al music while waiting for the next part of the webcast is pretty funny.

Planetrain

This is terrible logic. You hope it goes slow? That’s the measure?
Time has nothing to do with it. A good contract stands on its own, not whether or not we “sufficiently waited” or not.

cornbeef007

+1.............

TED74

We have a new MEC, new negotiators, multiple pending JVs and one of our scope experts jumping to management. We haven't even exchanged openers. We have no idea where UAL will end up or if they can do some heavy lifting for the industry this time.

If you think time is irrelevant, you don't appreciate what all would have to be accomplished in the next 12 months to have a final agreement in that time. I wouldn't trust such a rushed deal to be favorable for pilots, particularly if the pending JVs we know about weren't finalized also or first. As someone with decades left, I personally also see the continuing flood of new Delta pilots as a good thing. Prioritization of long-term gains over short-term ones is more likely with an increasing percentage of the list having to contemplate the long view. Our leverage increases with the training squeeze that has been discussed for years but won't really begin for another year or two.

If the perfect deal were ready to sign by December 19, I'd sign it. There's just no way (IMHO) we'll have a great contract ready by then and I'm glad that Wall Street is being given realistic expectations about negotiations.

ClimbClimbNow

Heard Ed mention he'll be watching the marketplace, as in UAL and AAL, and also that he'd be looking for opportunities to improve the efficiency of the airline. Some of these efficiencies from previous contracts and their effects on various seniority levels have been discussed on APC previously.

This could be suggesting his strategy...or ________.

JamesBond

I would say there is pretty close to 1000 guys that might disagree with you. Or are you saying '**** them'.

TED74

14,500 pilots and counting. Your 1,000 number is probably very low.
We're not all going to agree. I rarely have my family of four in agreement on much of anything.

I said thank goodness because I don't favor a rushed agreement. Plenty of people would benefit from a quick deal. I don't begrudge them and don't expect them to agree with me. If you see that as FU, you must love today's society focusing increasingly on division.

JamesBond

So.... now this is math in public. 425 +525 = 950. Pretty close to 1000. That's just mandatory retirements over the next 2 years. per YOUR numbers. First of all, I'm not advocating rushing a deal, but time is not as on our side as you seem to think. It is if you are under 60 years old (I am), but those over that age have a very loud clock ticking. And yeah, what you are saying to them is FU.

And what is it exactly that you don't begrudge them?

gzsg

Spot on.....

All monetary gains (including retirement) will be fully retroactive.